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/leftypol/ is a non-sectarian board for leftist discussion. Join our matrix! https://matrix.to/#/+leftychat:matrix.org IRC: Rizon.net #bunkerchan https://qchat.rizon.net/?channels=bunkerchan

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The Great Internet Purge Anonymous 06/30/2020 (Tue) 01:07:52 No. 653253
>Leaks showing collaboration between social media sites and law enforcement during protests >reddit banning "extremist" subs >Internet Archives being targeted for "copyright" infrigement >Feds trying to kill encryption >Twitch apparently censoring >Youtube targeting "extremist" youtube channels >Twitter doubling down on "fact checking" and censorship We have for a long time, been aware of most of these things, but it seems as though the Great Internet Purge has decisively begun. The bar for what is considered "extremism" has been progressively lowered over the past few years, and privacy rights/surveillance has. Anarchism, Socialism, and Communism are all being put into the same category as fascism and white supremacy now, as expected. Over the past few years, I have always been against censorship of the fascists online because I knew it would one day be applied to the left, and what is happening now is exactly that. The timing and context of these happenings make it almost totally apparent that this is all coordinated; covid also seems to be very convenient for them as well. This is a coup by the tech companies/establishment to censor any dissent online, specifically on platforms that occupy a huge space in public discourse. The only question that remains is the question of what is to be done. Should we simply find and promote alternative platforms, or start using TOR, dark web platforms, and/or other decentralized networks? Discuss. Also everybody needs to seriously reconsider their OPSEC or lack thereof. VPNs, proxies, and TOR should be allowed here honestly.
Are you continually deleting this thread to make me paranoid or something? Geez.
That's my reading of the situation. They're using the moral outrage of Floyd's death and the fear of the coronavirus to try and take over the internet for good.
>>653258 My bad friend, I accidentally spoilered the image the first time, then forgot the subject the second time.
>>653267 >VPNs, proxies, and TOR should be allowed here honestly. VPNs and TOR already are allowed, don't get mad because some autist spammer has gotten your exit node banned
Another thing is that we will need to learn how to COMPLETELY change our discourse. If we are being stopped from participating in the public conversation when we use explicitly socialist terms, then we need to be able to sneak our opinions under the radar, in a way where it will reach normies without setting off the alarm-bells. Luckily, this will be much easier for us than the right, because our politics are more intuitively humane.
>>653253 I 100% agree, but i think in the long run this stuff will bite them in the ass big time
>>653280 YES YES YES The far right pioneered the art of dogwhistle/exposing radical thesis looking "serious" and stuff, time for us to do the same
>>653283 This, clamping down on dissent is the sign of a weak regime, not one in a position of strength
>>653286 communist arguments don't really fit into dog whistles or cute rhetorical tricks
This is a huge mistake, they don't understand that the internet is a pressure valve, if you force all the extremists off the internet the only thing left for them to do is organize.
>>653276 This is news to me >>653283 I sure hope so, but I feel as though it will take be a while until we see it. >>653288 I was thinking the same thing, at least this makes it apparent that the left is now viewed as a legitimate threat. >>653290 They do if you dumb them down and avoid the usual jargon.
>>653294 the problem is if you dumb down the communist arguments they turn into liberal or socdem hogwash
>>653288 Isn't this porkies just seeking profits? I know the porkies control the state but Trump and friends are constantly clashing with big tech, or is it facade ?
I'm tempted to say the internet White Terror was inevitable under the current development of capitalism and the monopolization of the internet
>>653301 white terror historically leads to red terror in response
>>653253 We're working on getting an onion rolled out here in the next 3 weeks. I'd also like to get an eepsite up and running, as well.
>>653253 Literally doesn't affect me. Perks of living in a third world country.
>>653306 King shit
>>653302 lol since when? look at any Fascist country where red terror was nonexistant.
>>653306 Based.
>>653306 badass, gonna get my raspberry pi set up just for it any way i can track the progress of the site?
>>653306 based
>>653311 White terror in China led to communist revolution
>>653301 Most definitely, from a dialectical standpoint. >>653297 Basically I mean advocating for overtly marxist ideas but not labeling them as such. >>653306 ;-;7
>>653290 You can easily get the point across without using the real technical terms "Workplace Democracy" is a nice neologism/dogwhistle for example. "Citizen's empowerment" is another. We can talk about porkies, not the bourgeois. We can meme, not theorize.
>>653311 white terror is not fascist, i suppose it means from the status quo which is liberalism and centrism. Fascist would be brown or black terror
>>653316 I would join the matrix and ask rat about it. He's the main dev, basically.
How do you explain to radlibs that being anti-privacy and anti-free speech in the name of anti-racism/fascism/etc. is retarded?
>>653280 this is what should have been happening a very long time ago instead of autistically clinging to the jargon that's been propagandized against for decades
>>653331 You have to point to concrete examples of the left being censored with the pretext of being anti-extremism.
ITS THEIR PLOT imo the intelligence-industrial complex aka deep state + tech giants are gonna purge the internet of all non mainstream politics (i.e fascism/NRX, communism/anarchism/antifa, even alt lite and socdems). They are gonna try and replace all that shit to tamp down on the coming shitstorm due to the depression that is about to start getting really bad, especially in the US
>>653339 Being that heavy handed with repression is only going to make people much more mad, it's better to pacify extremists by cooptation rather than outright repression, they know this, it's how they survived the 30's and the 60's.
>>653324 >>653290 >>653286 Someone from this board wrote a manifesto for these things a few years ago. There's some points I don't agree with but it might be helpful
>>653335 What just happened indicates this old autistic jargon has traction
>>653344 I honestly think they don't know this. I think we are dealing with people who are extremely historically illiterate. They have probably not given this much thought beyond protecting muh liberal values.
>>653293 OH fuck, this actually makes complete sense. shit. probably gonna have a few more right wing shooting after this one, stay safe everyone
>>653339 >>653346 pretty based, i wish the left could mobilize a PR campaign of the scale of 2016 /pol/ influence but moreso. We cannot count on history or being right anymore
>>653306 that's fucking SICK dude i love you
>>653346 I don't agree with all of this, but a lot of this is good. I don't think we should completely disengage with IdPol, rather we should try to coopt such movements and make them aware of their internal class antagonism. I like the part about being pillars of society and civic nationalism (not necessarily bound to the nation-state). Go out comrades, and do good. We should have a "propaganda of the deed" thread.
>>653368 Propaganda of the deed never worked historically and is more likely to alienate the masses that not, working in and for the community has proved to be way more effective
these people have names and live in houses.
>>653379 Not the DirectX kind, silly. The "people doing nice praxis" kind.
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>>653346 Lots of good ideas here. I'd like to add, while we're on the subject: don't moralize, and be careful of criticizing people in a way that those who you are trying to convert could interpret as criticism of them. This is a major problem of leftist discourse, because we're always smugly pointing out the flaws in things and calling other people monsters. In practice, making people feel like shit just causes them to become defensive, apathetic or angry at YOU. You have to focus on how socialism is in their interest as part of the exploited working class. That's something anyone can potentially get on board with. Especially if they're also affected by social issues that are indirectly caused by capitalism.
>>653391 HOW MANY FUCKING CHAPOTARDS ARE GONNA COOOM HERE NOW THAT THEIR SUB IS BANNED
>>653422 They can take their counter-revolutionary IDPOL and keep right on walking
>>653253 Decentralization is the ONLY permanent solution.
>>653535 anarkid
>>653535 Of the internet or of organizations? If you mean the internet I probably agree with you
>>653290 dog whistles are fucking garbage because vague euphemisms with no concrete demands are coopted constantly by reformists and performative leftists.
>>653331 You don't. All websites that anyone uses are run by corporations (class enemies) anyways. Don't get too cozy with the idea of being free of censorship.
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>>653422 Truth is, this place was always Chapofied from the start.
>>653543 cry more MLfag, you're all so whiny
>>653543 anarkid is when you have any knowledge about how computer networks function
>>653535 In virtual space? Based In meatspace? Cringe
>>653253 Shit analysis. >Over the past few years, I have always been against censorship of the fascists online because I knew it would one day be applied to the left This is a retarded meme. You talk as if a tool needed to be created for fighting fascists online and then that tool could then be abused. The tool is there with or without fascists. >This is a coup The term doesn't fit, they are not taking power now. They have had the power for quite some time. >covid also seems to be very convenient for them No. Covid isn't a side thing. Covid is the main thing. Covid -> economic crisis -> people driven towards extremism. That's what they are reacting to.
>>653604 >Covid -> economic crisis -> Covid didn't cause the crisis, it was going on even before covid was reported.s
>>653293 stfu retard why are you butthurt about rightoids not being able to infest more brains?? >>653362 Are you retarded? The shootings used to happen because these bastards kept on radicalizing the mentally il. If anything this will reduce the flow you drama queens
>>653624 Posting may propagate may "get the message out" more but posting itself is an alternative to action for most online extremists, it lets you feel radical and doing something without creating political power the way irl organizing does. Rightoids will continue infesting people's brains anyway.
>>653604 >>653617 Seconding this. Read up on Michael Roberts (https://thenextrecession.wordpress.com/2020/03/15/it-was-the-virus-that-did-it/). COVID-19 is just making this even worse.
>>653617 this again. most economists predicted a recession was already coming and had started already (technically) the coronavirus just made it 20x worse
>>653667 >the coronavirus just made it 20x worse In other words, it's the reason we have an explosion of interest in radicalism that a mild and short recession phase wouldn't have caused, and the censorship is in reaction to that.
>>653707 basically. porky is scared of the coming insurrection
>>653750 Well if you view BLM etc as fash then yes Otherwise no
>>653756 that will just give rise to actual fascism in the long run since liberalism alone can’t keep an economy functioning by itself. like the Weimar Republic
I'm trying to use Youtube-dl to archive a Prolekult video, and while the video is still live on Youtube, it says "YouTube said: This video is unavailable." in the program. Oh shit. Oh shit oh shit oh shit. Am I too late? are they locking it down, preventing third party tools from accessing and archiving their videos in preparation for removal?
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>>653765 That's not really what gave rise to hitler, though. That;s a revisionist take. What gave rise to Hitler was a population desperate to end the decade of blood shed between social democrats and socialists in Germany after WW1. Hitler used a tired and desperate population to rise to power and over throw the government after Leftists set some state buildings on fire.
>>653773 yeah because the great depression and bread becoming the price of gold definitely had nothing to do with it, idealist autist.
>>653773 Interesting analysis worth taking into account One small quibble on details the Reichstag fire was a falseflag
>>653773 just so you know, no human being capable of love and self-reflection will ever give a flying fuck about your retarded culture war
>>653772 Download mediahuman or 4k video downloader
>>653792 There is some small truth to it, Stalin vs. Trotsky or more correctly the people who rallied to them as representatives of intensification or stabilization If you take a clear eyed look stabilization was the overwhelmingly popular of the two
>>653604 >The tool is there with or without fascists. Even if in the technical sense there are easy ways to shut down any opposition, intensified repression is never that simple. It also needs sufficient support among the people carrying out repression and at least resignation from the majority of the general population. If these two are missing, it will backfire. The tech giants eased us up for the private control of public spaces of communication by using fascists, whether or not most of the corporate overlords genuinely thought they are protecting people. What would have happened if social media platforms more or less took a free speech absolutist stance up until now, when the bourgeois state's security and even existence hangs in the balance? There would be a deep distrust of them among black people and anyone left of the dem establishment and they would flock en masse to alternative platforms or even the darknet. But this is a pipedream, isn't it? Well, people on the left concerned about the power of the american state (I think that is a broad and also fitting category) could have spoken up against that censorship while strongly opposing its targets. This might have counterbalanced the woke image which tech companies use to normalize the control they exert over public life.
>>653765 >liberalism alone can’t keep an economy functioning by itself Same as fascism, the are both capitalist systems. The nazis for example kept Germany's economy afloat by selling off nationalized assets and seizing new manufacturing. Later they relied more on slave labor, but in no way could Germany's economy keep functioning indefinitely. You can see these same tactics being used by America for example, today. >>653773 Hitler rose to power thanks to massive corporate support and a spooked bourgeoise that essentially handed the fascists power. The nazis lost the popular vote to the SDP and KDP. >>653750 >If an insurrection is coming in the next few years, it will be a fascist one. No. Also you forgot your flag. >>653362 stop samefagging
>>653797 You retards are really far gone aren't you?
>>653792 The Economy had been in recovery for a while by the time the NSDAP won their landslide victory. The economy being bad was not at the heart of why nazism arose.
>>653253 >I have always been against censorship of the fascists online... Fascist online have never really been targeted. It's always been slap on the wrist for these people. Any suppression they're getting now is only because our internet overlords are up to task while they root out leftism.
>>653280 Damn straight. Our "40% of cops" semi-meme is a step in the right direction, so is the broader left's use of 1312. These two will have a harder time of getting banned by the social media porkies.
I have this faint hope that this social media purge may bring back that older, more decentralized version of the internet I remember as a teen, with thousands of niche forums and blogs to browse. But meh probably won't happen.
Keep in mind, surveillance and repression costs money and resources. The security state is not in a great position right now. Opsec is only really necessary if your organizing or doing glowy shit imo. If we've learned anything from the heyday of fascism, it should be that reactionaries rely on shock to consolidate power. Their plans are contingent on a docile populous. Always remember that laws only exist if you believe in them, and the best defense is a good offense. >>653860 >"the NSDAP won their landslide victory." It wasn't really an election though. The communists and militant workers were crushed and terrorized, the SDP betrayed them and the nazis were already given power. >>653871 >Fascist online have never really been targeted. Yeah, they have even been caught in collaboration with LEO. Really how stupid do you have to be to be a fascist and attract the ire of law enforcement. There has always been a higher bar set for commies. >our internet overlords I know this is memeing, but does anyone really think the security state has enough resources right now, in order to purge all leftist discussion? Popular platforms have already been co-opted for a long time, but still dissent is growing. Anti-communism requires capital, and capital isn't doing very well right now.
>>653253 >Feds trying to kill encryption Not necessarily enforceable for this one though, it's mostly NSA and FBI butthurt because of the strength of the systems they built. >Twitter doubling down on "fact checking" and censorship >reddit banning "extremist" subs Quietly very important. The success of the Donald Trump campaign and also the Aut Right was very much thanks to alternative media campaigns with places like Twitter, Reddit and 4chan where the blatant bullshit they were touting was available, uncensored and "unslandered". We should watch for this one. Like sure Leftypol will remain but broad expansion, largely through social media is central to the American Revolutionary strategy at this stage. >Leaks showing collaboration between social media sites and law enforcement during protests By the way, this means private messages. Yes, your private messages.
>>653959 In order to spread on the normie platforms and pipeline to places like this that means we have to be able to play by the rules and TOS, which, we can. Rightists can't because every conversation will devolve into some kind of reactionary talking point but leftists can.
>>653958 >Really how stupid do you have to be to be... Correct, yes. The gulag is in fact for there own good. >Does anyone really think the security state has enough resources right now... I don't know fam our opposition in the past has gone to some crazy lengths to stifle even the smallest of leftist sympathies.
All of this reminds me a lot of "Brave New World". Why imprison dissenters, when you can simply force them off into hugboxes
>>653308 America controls the whole www
>>653624 >why are you butthurt about rightoids not being able to infest more brains?? why do you think they won't censor you too?
>>653253 Absolutely BASED. The autistic right would lose platform to lure more people in, while the leftists will go back to doing stuff IRL instead of LARPing online.
>>654080 This sounds very good until you realize that the autistic right will also go back to doing stuff IRL:
>>654090 >>654080 IRL is finished
>>653253 > Over the past few years, I have always been against censorship of the fascists online because I knew it would one day be applied to the left, and what is happening now is exactly that. Don’t kid yourself. It was going to happen regardless of whether ppl like Sargon of Akkad or Richard Spencer lost their patreon bux.
>>654090 The point is they're autistic, and they sound like autists, plus their Untermensch ass can't hide behind Anime girl profile pics.
>>654099 This can be said about the current left as well.
>>653253 everything except the internet archive purge is good tbh. (losing encryption is also bad, but i like the idea that if it's broken badly enough it will obliterate e-commerce. not going to happen but fun to imagine.)
>>653306 What does any of that mean? Sorry for being a newfag.
>>654153 onion roll is a type of omelette inserted into the asshole during a certain type of anal sex, usually into an androgynous one.
>>654117 Except leftists don't claim to be Ubermensch, and our whole ideology is not based on "my race is superior" shit.
>>654153 onion = tor-only website
https://archive.fo/7FtVI That's part of it. Someone showed me this today & it fell into place - bad shit is coming, so all alternative views (from /pol/ fashies to the Left) are getting purged, especially if they're remotely critical of Israel. One party "Woke" Neoliberal Plutocracy is the future.
>>653253 Is there an onionland bunker already? How about other alternatives, like something IPFS based (there was a project to make a decentralized imageboard on it IIRC)?
>>653290 We need a Leftist version of Molymeme or something.
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>>653904 You can do this with a lot of things, and I've seen dozens of them pop up over the past few weeks. See pic related for an example I saw today
>>653306 Absolutely based. Good to hear comrade. >>653384 Is "dual power"the term you're looking for?
>>653286 The far left and the far right are far too different for us to adopt their tactics, and actually have them work. >>653339 And it will not matter. Even if they managed to impose their propaganda network in time, the coming war will undo it. If the popular uprising won't destroy it first. Controlling information about material conditions is not the same as controlling material conditions themselves, and will not work for long. Material problems do not have idealist solutions.
>>654310 >The far left and the far right are far too different for us to adopt their tactics, and actually have them work. Why? Far rightists steal shit from leftists constantly, shouldn't we do the same?
>>653286 Recuperation renders a lot of this pointless unless it’s near blatant.
>>653306 Based
>>654319 a) because the ideas involved are more complicated. b) it's like asking why pacifists don't adopt violence to beat people into non-violence. many of the tactics of the right are only of use for reactionary ends.
>>653253 Reddit is gonna purity spiral and become irrelevant.
>>654346 I doubt it. reddit was already mostly neoliberals to begin with
>>653995 Do we get soma tho?
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>The Great Internet Purge What has to be understood about the social media biz is that the product is the users. What they doing is actually more like a closing shop sale. Neo-liberalism is killing the purchasing power of people, and with that the advertisement biz will dry up, since there's little purpose in advertising to broke people. With ever more aggressive catering to insufferable corporate world views, it will drive off users, and they will be able to fake mass appeal with bots for a while, and then like everything neo-liberalism has produced, disappear. Marx would see this as "the old that is dying" and would urge you to look towards the new that is struggling to being born. We have to take into account the material reality, why did the capitalists manage to capture communication between people. And here we have to say that it's the servers they could treat as capital which they could accumulate. There are other die-off scenarios, all there servers for the capitalist social media are bunched together in extremely densely and relatively few locations, which means they have become high value military targets, that are very hard to defend and easy to attack, this is to some extend replicating a similar scenario which ended fortresses in the middle ages. Capitalist crisis is increasing the tensions between rival powers as well as create new factions. Eventually the cost benefit analysis will tild towards attacks against these data centres, this will of course produce a counter tendency where the bunched up data centres produce external costs in terms of military defence spending to deter such attacks. And here we see where the avenue for the new systems to arise is situated, anybody who can deploy a different type of information architecture that does not have this downside will gain a civilisation advantage. This is what you have to look for.
>>654604 >Marx would see this as "the old that is dying" and would urge you to look towards the new that is struggling to being born. Minor correction, but this was Gramsci.
>>654229 Can you post the original URL? archive is blocking Tor via cloudflare's faggotry
>>653253 seem you were right, reddit just started its purge (with retarded as fuck rules)
Yeah, but people here still believe covid was real. Now the WHOaxers are pushing nother virus, just lol. You know if people didn't, we could have done the revolution today, instead we will go through of dozens of years of total devastation IF we make it before MAYBE hope could blossom again. Train's lost, faggots.
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>>653276 Why Permaban exit nodes then?
>>654271 THAT'S THE WAY TO DO IT
>>654117 I don't know about that, most of the leftists i've met irl have been cool people, also way better looking than any of the rightoids which was surprising considering the whole "haha weak soiboi" stereotype, it probably has to do with rightwingers thinking grooming yourself is gay
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>>654945 Right wingers don't groom themselves, that's for sure, but I've always viewed it as a more psychological thing-- like projecting their fear of emasculation onto the enemy or something. >>653995 Society in current year has eerie parallels to both 1984 and Brave New World, but I wouldn't call it a dystopia as that term kind of loses meaning when applied to anything but literature. >>654545 It can be had for very cheap on the dark web or oversees pharmacies. I've heard it is quite enjoyable.
>>654945 Attractive people and successful people are usually apolitical. The left is more attractive in current year because it has male gays(most on average attractive group) and young women.
>>655022 A lot of right wingers don't work out either, even though they're constantly harping on about it, many of them are overweight or obese, at least from what I've seen irl. I've also noticed a lot of them are short. And yeah, it probably has to do with fear of emasculation and overcompensating. It's very pathetic. Androgynous people are statistically much happier and live better lives. "Research studies have shown associations between androgyny and a wide range of positive outcomes such as self-esteem, satisfaction with life, marital satisfaction, subjective feelings of well-being, ego identity, parental effectiveness, perceived competence, achievement motivation, cognitive complexity when evaluating careers, cognitive flexibility, and behavioral flexibility." Here is an interesting article: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/blurred-lines-androgyny-and-creativity/ >>655107 and don't forget straight femboys
>>655107 >The left is more attractive in current year because it has male gays(most on average attractive group)
>>653253 >Youtube targeting "extremist" youtube channels they better not bull down Burzum, I need that music
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>>655107 >the left is more attractive damn right
>>655155 this is just normal burger shit tbh t. burger
>>655107 >The left is more attractive Not sure about that one, here's a study on that finds that attractiveness increases likelihood for economically right-wing positions. Consider that this study does hold some ideological bias in the abstract and conclusions so read that with a grain of salt, but their data seems reasonable. Another thing here, this is correlative bio-politics and i would caution against basing any theories on that. Bio-politics derived hypothesis have a really bad track-record of making decent predictions. Those only exist because people want mental shortcuts. Just for the fun of it i included another study that sais that men with more upper body strength support wealth redistribution. I'm going to say this again bio-politics doesn't work, this is for intellectual amusement.
>>653253 >>Twitter doubling down on "fact checking" and censorship Gee, you mean like bunkerchan does?
You really dont have to worry about socialist, communist, and anarchists being censored anywhere. It just doesnt happen
>>658509 bruh the national communist party was literally illegal till a couple years ago
>>658509 It absolutely happens if you dont toe the SJW line.
>>658518 Which means you are being less censored now, due to a reluc of the 1950s being overturned. You don't have to worry about censorship, antifas aren't even excluded from Republican concentions, unlike Pat Buchanan
>>658526 You got banned because they mistok you for a right-winger, again, you don't have to worry about censorship
>>658537 we're not concerned about government censorship but rather censorship on major internet platforms >>658544 there are literally banned phrases on youtube my dude
>>658537 >Which means you are being less censored now Not really? All trade unions are banned and no one form one. The only communist parties that are not banned are the small ones, which are basically all of them as the most popular 'socialist' party, the PPP, was crushed by the US-funded Zia and subsequent leaders after his assassination by the US and also became liberal.
>>658549 >there are literally banned phrases on youtube my dude Yes, and they dont relate to anything you believe in or care about
>>658526 >the SJW line. so Petit bourgeoisies and labor aristocracy interests
>>658555 nice trips, but false. are you a sjw by chance?
>>658549 >we're not concerned about government censorship but rather censorship on major internet platforms Party conventions are private events, and the parties themselves are private coorporations. This why they dont have to have a vote over the nominees or respect the results of the primaries
>>658556 Okay, take BLM, where do you actually differe from an SJW? Would your view point be normal on a place like resetera? >>658559 No. What position that you hold is being censored, by any if these means?
>>658574 can't say "clown world" can't "all lives matter" inb4: "those are right wing do whistles!!!" just because they use those phrases in a certain way shouldn't mean that I can't use them in my own way. Also, "first they came for the Nazis, and I said nothing...." I realize this is ironic, but I think it's absolutely true that we need to work to protect free speech for everyone including Nazis because I am not down with social media corporations becoming the arbiters of what we're allowed to say online. This is an extremely slippery slope.
>>658597 Those phrases did originate with right-wingers though. Again, you are complaining about friendly fire
>>658603 >you are complaining about friendly fire You really think the social media corporations are our friends!?!? Also, isn't friendly fire worth complaining about? And no, actually, "clown world" was not originally a right-wing thing, it was appropriated by them, much like "kek".
>>658574 >Okay, take BLM, where do you actually differe from an SJW? Would your view point be normal on a place like resetera? I have no idea what "resetera" means. BLM and socialists have in common that they want police brutality stopped preferably yesterday. And the private prison complex in the US needs to go because it's "slavery-light". But that's where the commonalities end, BLM want more dark-skinned petit bourgoise business and more dark skinned labour aristocrats, and socialists don't care about this, because there's no gain if you switch out the skin tone in capitalist hierarchies, there's also no race-identity based trickle down economics, dark skinned labour aristocrats and petite bourgs won't give a flying fuck about workers that have the same skin-tone as them just like pale capitalists don't give a fuck about pale workers. The relative gains pale workers made in post WW2 era were the result of class-struggle and the racism was what limited the scope of those gains.
>>658617 >You really think the social media corporations are our friends!?!? You have remarkebly cozy relstionship with them for enemies. The clown world phrase did originate with right wingers, kek how ever is just a world of warcraft meme. You type it to write lol, this way the horde reads kek as lol.
>>658635 >But that's where the commonalities end, BLM want more dark-skinned petit bourgoise business and more dark skinned labour aristocrats, and socialists don't care about this You both share this talking point
>>658652 >The clown world phrase did originate with right wingers You are misinformed. Do some research.
>>653368 You seem to be a reddit refugee given the spacing, if i were you i would lurk more and naturalise yourself before assuming this place has tolerance of reddits residents
>>658652 >You have remarkebly cozy relstionship with them for enemies. you're fucking retarded
>>658635 resetera is a radlib gaming forum I believe. Just another consumerist hellhole probs.
>>654333 >unless it’s near blatant even then the jury's out on whether it still won't get recuperated. che guevara shirts would like a word, and i've no doubt guillotine fashion chic will come into play sooner or later
>>658574 >Okay, take BLM, where do you actually differe from an SJW? sjws want gibs for blacks and more female ceos, not racial and economic equality. you should know this if you're lurking this site, unless you are a /pol/ emigre in which case welcome and prepare to be breadpilled
>>658884 >not racial and economic equality Is this really what BLM wants? What exactly is their vision of "racial and economic equality". Is there more to it than reparations? Do they support a democratically planned economy?
>>658895 BLM doesn't want anything, it's a big tent that is doing it's best to avoid talking about any demands in fear of upsetting this or that group, and they will especially not talk about any sort of economic equality because that will spook the lib establishment. the only thing everybody can agree on is that cops must be demilitarised, and that's about it. most real leftists who protest under the BLM's logo will likely outright disagree on any other aims BLM mouthpieces will want to push, including that recruiting black cops somehow reduces cop violence, or that reparations will do anything besides offsetting the brutality of capitalism against the black working class for a year or two, or that economic justice is the same as economic equality which it absolutely isn't.
>>658895 >>658910 (me) btw the beauty of the BLM protests is that any bourgs who would try to control the movement are so far off mark with how grassroots it became, they won't be able to speak for it especially since the establishment has no intention of carrying out even the most basic demands of the crowd and mouthpieces will have a hard time trying to calm the population down as a result
>>658910 >economic justice is the same as economic equality which it absolutely isn't. Interesting. Care to elaborate?
>>658921 >mouthpieces will have a hard time trying to calm the population down as a result And in this unrest you see an opportunity for socialism in murica? Or is that a good thing more because it destabilizes murica and the liberal world order, opening the door for socialism elsewhere in the world? Or both?
>>658509 >>658537 this is retarded fukuyamism >communism is legal now so that means it can’t possibly change in the future! peak post-left arrogance
>>658943 Also r/chapotraphouse was just banned from reddit this week. This fact should end this debate.
>>658924 I don’t know why these retards are using “economic equality”. to me, communism means the abolition of exploitation. I’m guess that’s what they meant.
>>658924 economic justice (positive discrimination) = pay gibs to disadvantaged because of their disadvantage, aka reparations and things like that economic equality (no discrimination) = same opportunities for all regardless of wealth, aka structural changes to the system and public service investment that diminishes or outright removes the importance of personal wealth with regards to life and work opportunities >>658933 both to be honest. right now the protests are like a lump of clay ready to be molded, but this is the point where grassroots movements with good organisation and demands can begin to seize the initiative. people are protesting because they know the system has failed us, so there isn't a more perfect moment to present alternatives. elsewhere is the same deal, but it also stops american interventions into the politics of other governments at least for a time. if the american government turned inwards for a time to focus on its own internal problems, it would do the world a whole lot of good, but also the american working class needs to seize this moment for itself because all people's deserve to be liberated.
>>658954 >I don’t know why these retards are using “economic equality”. i'm just talking about transitional demands, which exist more for reasons of strategy than anything else. we all know even economic equality is absolutely unpalatable to porky given how offended he was by even milquetoast social democracy
There is gonna be a serious economic crisis and the ruling class knows it. There was going to be one anyway but with COVID-19 it has accelerated and the real ramifications, especially the collapse of the export sector, in, for example, the car industry, will probably be felt in a few months and there is even fear of a second wave, at which point they might not even given a shit anymore. Sorry buddy, your grandma has to die for "the economy." So they're pre-emptively curbing platforms where people might read about alternative systems, CTH was a pretty big sub and it drew in harmless young Sanders voters who then got exposed to actual Marxism and communism, you can go on r/Sandersforpresident and pretty much talk about communism and Marxism openly and they listen. I saw many Liberation News article on that sub (the newspaper of the PSL) and they all got upvoted and people were agreeing with it. Plus, with all those state interventions, the way that the neoliberal government can suddenly spend trillions on the economy like it's no biggie ruptered neoliberal hegemony. People see how big businesses are bailed out but they can't even get 100 bucks extra on unemployment benefits. The protests after the death of George Floyd probably were the final straw, and they decided to take action.
>>653280 >>653286 >communists do not conceal their goals. t. Marx
>>653253 Imagine using the internet to LARP over a revolution which won't happen for decades.
>>658985 I don't know if there will be an ensuing revolution, but the collapse of the liberal world order is nigh.
Quickly browsed the normie subs like r/politics and r/worldnews about this and they're have zero self-awareness. They just gloat that the MAGA subs got banned, but that the biggest leftist sub also got purged? Crickets. They even cry for more censodership against "Russian and Chinese disinformation" - why do these people exist?
>>659032 >why do these people exist? Propaganda.
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>>658992 That, probably. But I dont know what that will entail.
>>659054 "Lul ur both dum chegmayt" -Plato
>>659032 >why do these people exist? Ultimately glowblack king bots and accounts exist to set the discourse via artificially created “support” and disinformation blitz
>>659081 "lel no u" -Aristotle
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>>659079 it will entail fascism.
>>655145 They already banned Varg
>>653577 um chapo started years after /leftypol/ did. we were the "dirtbag left" before it was cool!

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