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/leftypol/ is a non-sectarian board for leftist discussion.

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Anonymous 11/17/2019 (Sun) 05:32:47 No. 129417
what do if trump gets 2nd term? serious thread

pic intimately related
Not continue to get preoccupied over the dog-and-pony show known as US presidential elections.
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>>129423
doomer time or pic related?
>what to do if x bourgeois politician beats y bourgeois politician
>>129433
Neither?
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Celebrate the further success of Xi, Assad, Kim, Putin, khomeini and the shaming of the whore.
Don't worry. Everything is accelerationist now.
>>129433
pic related
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>>129417
Be thankful that Le Drumpf forces shitlibs to pretend they're outraged by capitalism, thanks to Dup's anti-PC meanie poopoohead behavior huwting their feefees. As opposed to if someone more generic like Pence were impeached into office, let alone Guacobowl or Pantsuits'n'Mushroom Clouds having won the election.

>>129449
This, setting aside his rhetoric, Trump is totally unremarkable.
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>""""""if""""""
>>129417
How dumb are you that you haven't assumed that Trump would get 8 years this whole time?
>>129417
Same you did under last election: nothing. Same you did as under Obama election, who did same things as Trump (overthrow governments, jail child immigrants, drone people, be corrupt in the Ukraine).
It's the banners with "Chad" written on them that do it for me. Also a Romanian flag for some reason?
I'm more interested in what will happen if Trump loses and then contests the result
>>130219
If that coincides with a great economic depression, that might the catalyst for an insurgency
>>130216
It's actually the flag of Chad. Same colours as Romania's.
fuck i hope comrade trump wins again
>>130232
Nice. Well done comrade, this is quality OC
Then the coming depression will happen on his watch. Whether or not this will opens up a space for another FDR scumbag or a genuine socialist movement depends on the organizing we do right now.
>>130241
Nah this isn't OC Ive seen this meme floating around for a while.
What is the opinion of Trump among his supporters at the moment?
>>130271
Supportive as always. Hasn't really changed tbh.
>>129417
>what do if trump gets 2nd term? serious thread
Well, he should, to accelerate collapse of World Neoliberal system.
I don't think there's anything to do directly. If he gets a second term the two right wing factions that are fighting right now will escalate.
Look for opening that this fighting creates, that all you can realistically do.
>>129417
It's Bernie or the guillotines.

People who advocate non-voting are useful idiots btw. The system doesn't care if you """protest""" by not voting. Everyone is more than happy to accept an election where only 30% of eligible voters turn out, it makes no difference. What they actually fear is high turnout, because most of the country leans left economically (even if they don't identify with certain labels).

VOTE IN THE PRIMARIES
>>130538
You know, there really isn't any harm in voting for Bernie. He might not even be able to enact his promises, but his support base growing is what is really important, as they will form lasting political organizations.
Just google "am i registered to vote" and find your way through until you register online tbh
>>129417
>dems continue to flip out for four more years
>discuss nothing of import except trump bad
>run michelle obama in 2024
Assuming he even makes it to elections and wins primaries I think that depends who he goes up against. If it's up against a more left leaning candidate then the Democratic part returns to the centrism it was before and increases idpol. If it's against a centrist then it would lead to only delaying the US going further left. No matter who Trump would be against it means more fascists and neoliberal dictators around the world and more coups on leftist governments. Rooting for accelerationism is just brainlette tier ideology.
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>>130552
Cursed timeline
Michelle Obama Vs Kanye West
>>130578
Well, unelected investors and CEOs really rule a capitalist state - so it only makes sense that professional entertainers and attention grabbers would serve best as facade for them.
>>130017
>>>129449
This, setting aside his rhetoric, Trump is totally unremarkable
I agree
>>129433
Only in minecraft. Nice try FBI.
He probably won't but it means very little. Only thing with a moderate impact would be if Bernie somehow won. Democrats have made it clear that they don't want anything to change except to make fascism look nicer, the way Obama was able to sell bullshit for 8 years. That's why the Democrats are so chickenshit instead of outright declaring the Trump and friends are Nazis, because Trump and friends are literal Nazis (as are the people Clintonian Democrats are boosting in other countries like Ukraine).

Trump has basically been told not to fuck with the apparatus Bush and Obama built, and since we've lived in a de facto dictatorship since 2001 it makes little difference who sits in the White House because all of the important shit has been delegated to undemocratic institutions. I don't think Retard-Man has any coherent plans and certainly Retard-Man isn't making any decision of importance. Obama didn't make any important decision either, nor Bush before him, but both were far better at appearing like they were at least competent and knew what their masters were doing. Trump is a laughingstock and a joke around the world, a living symbol of the ruling class' contempt for those retarded enough to actually believe in the Trump narrative.
>>130576
The US isn't going remotely Left without a war. Sanders might salvage something out of the wreckage that is the United States of America, but the fascists have already made it clear they will fight to the death and lay waste to hundreds of millions of Americans; and with the machinery Bush built, they can genocide 200 million Americans if they really have to.

The last chance to fight was the 1990s, but the left in the '90s was totally bewildered and the winds of history were completely against them. The only factions with any will to fight at all were rightists of various stripes, while the socialist left was reduced to meekly enabling liberalism's worst excesses. That's why you have socialists today enabling the asinine Green agenda instead of calling bullshit on the whole rotten project, when a decent socialist hoping to have any popular support should have just told the Greens to get the fuck out. I get why it was done, because the cause of socialism was so utterly wrecked by neoliberalism that it became nearly inconceivable, but the socialist left was unable to understand exactly why it came to this without ascribing to capitalism spooky powers. If they had tried to understand the root of capitalism's continued vitality, they wouldn't be making the alliances they are making now under any circumstances.
>>130576
Still, I agree that "accelerationism" is retarded larper thinking. The machinery of capitalism pretty much runs on autopilot now - it cares not about some silly political narrative or feels. I'm voting Bernie in the hopes that, maybe, we don't have to fight WW3 if he can somehow last in office.
>>131034
>the root of capitalism's continuing vitality
Elaborate, please.
>>131090
Well, it's certainly not because people actually believe capitalism is an efficient system at anything whatsoever, or whatever transparent sop Randroids sell to the plebs. What people believe has remarkably little to do with any ideology's staying power really, but more than hegemonic ideas capitalism relies on a machine which, day after day, reproduces human misery for its own sake because immiserated humans are easier to control. Thus we have some bizarre logic where the police state is sold to people as a service, and people literally pay willingly for their own poison and their own oppression (and occasionally, your choice to pay is made under extreme duress short of forcibly extracting the funds out of your account). That's the triumph of capitalism. But often critics of capitalism point to the era of robber barons when they really need to look at the consolidation of state power and the rise of these extremely massive institutions that pervade every sphere of life - for example, the state schooling system which decides what you're going to be allowed to be from about age 5 onward. There's never going to be a revolution in a society where such institutions operate smoothly, and there was a reason why when the Cultural Revolution went down in China, school was cancelled. (And no, this isn't some conservitard "public schools are bad" argument, if such a system did not exist then the state would simply write off the vast majority of the population as uneducable but compulsory schooling presents an entry point for the state into private life and access to impressionable minds, which is literally the only reason why public schooling was ever allowed to be a thing. And now that a self-perpetuating class of technicians has been built and mass armies are no longer the way wars are fought, schools have become little more than prisons for 80% of the youth in them and a moneymaking scam for colleges and the education industry.)

There are a number of other examples I can point to, but this is not some battle of ideas and framing it in such a way is counterproductive. The ideas of the ruling class are in every epoch the ruling ideas, Marx figured that shit out and there's no win through argumentation or debate on that front.
Celebrate.

Trump is the best thing to have happened to the world and the left in a while. Bad management of the USA, sliding the empire down, inciting radicalisation in society.

If berny gets beaten it only further pushes people to the far left.
>>131101
A rather bleak outlook, though I can hardly blame you.I agree that capitalism's continuing existence is not thanks to any legitimacy it has among the people, but I'm not sure I completely agree with the rest of your post, especially on revolution being impossible in countries with a public education.

What's your outlook in the long term for Burgerland and the West, and how should socialists react to all this? Or is the war completely lost?
>>129423
First post best post. Obama and hillary were just the smiling "human face" for American imperialism. Trump and rest of republicans are at least honest about their position.
>>131108
Trump is just the next incarnation of Reagan though. There's nothing new or gained there.
>>131127
I don't think it's completely lost, just that there's a long way to fall, and at present the anti-capitalist movement is dismal. I don't think anything changes without building from the foundations something completely different. The present, academic left is utterly incapable of even thinking about a challenge to ruling class ideology, because its position is entirely dependent on such thinking. Maybe something can start or has started in recent times, but it's going to look a lot uglier than the idealized vision of bright young educated leftists. The left would have to be ready to play very dirty, and by that I don't mean the left should be stabbing the working class and the poor in the back like some sniveling centrists. There just seems to be no will to hate the enemy and attack them in a meaningful way. When the Chicoms fought, they were willing to drag landlords to mob justice. The American left is neutered compared to that, and its leadership seems allergic to anything that might actually win a small base of tangible power.

Maybe I'm wrong about just how bad the situation is, but it's going to take a lot before people give up their marks of privilege and status that they've literally killed to attain. That has been my experience all my life. The last thing people have is a false pride.
>>131108
Really, Hillary would have done more to run the country into the ground than Trump. The incompetence of that woman is staggering, but liberals convince themselves that retardation is some sort of intellect. Obama, after all, was a more aggressive tyrant than even Bush, and that's saying a lot; and though liberals might believe in Obama, most of the country rightly did see him as a tyrant, even if a relatively benevolent and inoffensive one, and that did set the seeds for the present instability we have today. An actually competent manager - and I don't think the ruling class can produce such a figure because of its own sickness - would be worse than the gong show that the ruins of the republic would give us. I don't see President Rodham - and she would insist on being called that, I guarantee - being anywhere near the bullshitter that Obama was, nor being capable of governing a fish bowl without managing to fuck up with some cockamamie scheme.
>>130546
this. might as well. whether bernie pussies out or gets couped, he's the real option for acceleration towards an actual american socialist movement
>>132123
America will never be socialist, the only solution for the burger quetion is nuclear.
>>132103
>Hillary would have done more to run the country into the ground
>>132126
>the only solution for the burger question is nuclear.

There might be overlap between these two statements.
>>131108
>If berny gets beaten it only further pushes people to the far left.
C O P E
>>129417
>what if Trump wins
Based if he goes against Warren or Biden
Terrible if he goes against Bernie
>>132304
Against Warren would be bad too because she's "just as left as Bernie"
Trump himself has actually completely checked out from actually doing politics stuff and is now basically solely treating the job like a role in one of his TV appearances and only really talks / tweets about how much people love him and the impeachment nonsense
It's all these reptiles that are serving under him and constantly lobbying him to give them the rubberstamp for their evil schemes that we need to watch out for. Ive often compared the modern state of American politics to the politics of a late Chinese dynasty or the Late-Roman Empire where the nominal emperor just spends all day fucking around and entertaining the masses while a virtual army of courtiers and miscreants actually run shit behind the scenes
>>133126
I hope that was sarcasm.
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>>133129
Buddy I WISH America right now was like the Qing dynasty in 1900. America still has the petrodollars and the world's scariest intelligence services despite the internal rot and military blunders.
>>133130
"just as left as Bernie" is what libs and media will say to justify never running anyone other than a clinton clone

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