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/leftypol/ is a non-sectarian board for leftist discussion.

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Éire/pol/ Anonymous 11/14/2019 (Thu) 11:27:52 No. 126351
Are there any Irish people on Lefty/pol/. Compared with /pol/ I don't see a massive presence of Irish people. I was thinking of starting an Éire/pol/ thread,but I won't bother if it's just going to die immediately
I'm from the North but happy to try and keep it going
>>126356
Of course that's Ireland
How do you contend with the need to leave the EU for socialism to take form, yet Ireland almost entirely relies on some of the worst aspects of the EU?
>>126754
I mean the biggest part Ireland relies on is the four freedoms RE the North.
What is the opinion of the IRA in north and the rest of Ireland? Are republicans stronger in numbers in occupied Ireland? How strong is republicanism all together?
>>126834
The IRA doesn't have much support in the North - certainly not the newer versions.
Not that there aren't a lot of people who want a united Ireland but people don't want war.
From my perspective, people are always happy to talk about wanting an united Ireland but there's no action behind it. The political parties down south don't even have a plan proposed in the event of a vote.

>>126771
Not really though. The only reason there is an issue when it comes to the custom's union is because of how the EU operates - border control wasn't really a thing pre-Troubles from what I understand.
If Ireland also left the EU there could still be arrangements for a frictionless border. The EU's role can be taken over, it's not as if it only works because of the EU. If anything the EU plays almost a hindrance in that it's border arrangement is based on economic policy that involves almost 30 other countries so that it cannot make an exception.
I was thinking more about Ireland being a tax haven. It's quite the dilemma that the EU needs to be gotten rid of for socialism to come about yet Ireland will be so significantly impacted by its loss. Rather difficult to balance.
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>>126351
Finally, a thread I can post these
Ireland's Ruthless Vigilantes Taking Care of Drug Dealers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDIr2rVaQaI
Spotlight: New IRA - The Murder of Lyra McKee
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSC-I1aAX5c
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Thoughts on Republican Sinn Fein?
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>>126351
https://www.solidnet.org/meetings-and-statements/imcwp/21st-international-meeting-of-communist-and-workers-parties/
Does anyone know why the Communist Party of Ireland didnt attend this?
the WP's statement seems to imply they were talking shit about the CP of Turkey:
>The IMCWP is an important event for our parties. The WPI wishes to make clear its condemnation of the provocative action of a group which sent a letter to the members of the IMCWP invited to this 21st International Meeting that goes against the Communist Party of Turkey, which, following a decision by the Working Group of the IMCWP, co-hosts this year's IMCWP together with the KKE. We condemn this provocation and stand firmly in solidarity with our comrades in the TKP.
any info on this?
You guys got any advice on joining youth orgs in rural Ireland? I'm in Kerry and I'd probably have to go to cork to join anything.
>>127520
If you know of a branch in Cork why not ask if they know of one in Kerry?
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Hey Irish comrade(s?), I'm a burger prole with some family in Ireland (grandparents generation) and I'm thinking about visiting for a few months, doing some workaway farm work at first (WWOOF or something) and looking for a some contracting work as well because my trade is construction. I know you get plenty of obnoxious plastic paddy burgers but I figure if I have some self awareness and don't spout off about muh heritage people won't mind too much yeah? I'd like to travel around the country but my family's from (and in) Swinford in Mayo. Ideally I'd also like to go to the North and on both sides of the border take some kind of part in the socialist politics around, but I lived in Africa for a while and know how hard it can be to break into something like that coming from the outside. If you have any advice about that or general thoughts I'd really appreciate it. Pic related is a transcript from an interview my aunt did with my great grandmother about her growing up on the River Moi.
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>>127587
>have some self awareness and don't spout off about muh heritage people won't mind too much yeah?
Pretty much. also remember not to randomly spark up conversations with people about the IRA / the Troubles. You risk offending people or getting the shit beat out of you if youre not careful (especially in the North). Keep that between your comrades.
>>127864
Sounds good, yeah I figured, that kind of thing is the same in most places and I wouldn't go in presuming that it's an easy topic to broach.

I do however have a starry plough tattooed on my forearm, not even as a we wuz thing but just because Connolly has always been an inspiration and he and his people were very active around where I'm from in the US. Most of my US historical political sympathies are with the Panthers and Bernadette Devlins appeal to the common struggle between the Panthers and Irish Republicans resonated with me so I saw it as a way to mark some loyalty to that common struggle and radical tradition, and agreement with Devlin's contempt for Irish-Americans betraying it to assimilate into white America. Thats the context tho still understandable if having it in Ireland as an American seems to be in poor taste or just laughable
>>127946
Which starry plough is it? like, the constellation only or the older version? I doubt anyone would question it if it was just the stars, but if its the other one you might get slagged. I doubt anyone would find it offensive though. You wont offend anyone by talking about Connolly either, even the libs like him for his republicanism. Also when i say "IRA" i mostly mean the Provos & the dissidents, most people have positive opinions of the Old IRA, but if you dont want to learn the differences between all the different versions, maybe just avoid the topic altogether lmao.
Also: if youre in Dublin you might want to check out Connolly Books in Temple Bar. Its run by the Communist Party of Ireland & their Secretary General is usually there & a good man for a chat.
https://www.connollybooks.org/
>>128057
Its the old version from the flag yeah. Sounds good at the least maybe it'll be a conversation starter. Thanks for the rec I'll put it on my list for sure.
>>128057
>>128065
And I know enough about the different iterations of the IRA to avoid that confusion at least lol, I've gotten some basic impressions like that from family who make exactly the kind of original are freedom fighters, Provos are either complicated and made some really bad decisions or just bad terrorists.
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can someone give me a rundown on all the signifcant sects of the IRA and why they came about?
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>>128560
With pleasure.
The first iteration of the IRA was founded in 1919 by members of the Irish Republican Brotherhood, who organised the 1916 Rising. They fought the War of Independance til the signing of the Anglo-Irish Treaty in 1922. At which point they split into the pro-treaty National Army (supported the partitioned Free State under the crown) and the anti-treaty IRA or Irregulars (rejected the Free State gov). These two fought the Civil War til it ended in 1923 with a Free State victory. The Nat. Army became the Irish Defence Forces and the Irregulars would continue to exist in the background til another split in 1969.
Over the 40 years the IRA began to shift towards Marxism, which the more old-fashioned republicans didnt like. The split happened when the leadership tried to end the policy of abstentionism in the Free State gov which was traditionally seen as illegitemate to republicans. They split into the Official IRA (Marxists) and the Provisional IRA (Catholics, nationalists, socialists).The Provos recieved funding and weapons from Irish Americans and Gaddaffi's Lybia while the Officials got them from the USSR and DPRK. The Provos would take over as the main IRA during the Troubles while the Officials would call a ceasefire in 1972 leading to another split creating the the Irish National Liberation Army. I should also mention that Sinn Féin, the political wing of the IRA also split in 1969 into Provisional SF, nowadays just SF, and Official SF, now known as the Workers Party of Ireland.
So the Provos waged a guerilla war against the Brits, the Unionist paras, and the Officials & INLA until the Good Friday Agreement in 1998, when they officially ended the armed struggle & agreed to decomission their weapons. The Officials would decomission in 2010 (although theyre rumoured to have hidden around 5000 ak-47s for a rainy day) around the same time as INLA. They all decided to pursue their goals through electoral politics.
Now we move on to the contemporary dissident groups who rejected the GFA:
The Continuity IRA emerged from a split with the PIRA over abstentionism in 1986 but would only become active after the start of the peace process. Their political wing is Republican SF & they believe in creating a socialist, federal united Ireland & that they are the only *true* Irish gov. Theyre pretty irrelevant now but have allegedly resurfaced in the face of Brexit.
The New IRA is made up of multiple dissident republican groups (including the Real IRA which split from the Provos in 1997). These guys mostly police areas the PSNI are too scared to and they recently killed a journalist by accident so everyone hates them.
A couple of groups calling themselves INLA have cropped up aswell, but theyre mostly just drug dealers now.
And thats pretty much it. If i missed any or got anything wrong nobody carbomb me k thanks.
It's worth mentioning that every single sect after the civil war commited multiple massacres
>>128930
The Old IRA werent angels either. They were at war tbf, same as the Provos.
>>128894
I thought some degree of Marxism was a part of Irish independence from the beginning?
>>129235
Individual members an organizations within, such as James Connolly, the Irish Citizens Army, and the Limerick Soviet, were, yeah. But I think that anon is referring to it being in the organizational foundation of the faction and not only an element in a wide net organization.
Greetings from Italy.
A few questions more about Irish mainstream politics than militant republicanism.
1) Are FF and FG basically the same in terms of ideology, social classes they appeal to and the way they act when in government? I remember reading something about that and the conclusion was that their constituencies were very much the same in economic and social terms but basically many people vote one or the other for reasons like being born in pro-treaty families (and voting FG) or anti-treaty families (and voting FF). Is that true?
2) How much influent is the Catholic Church? Is it correct to say that they still control the school system and there isn't and actual secular educational system like everywhere else in Europe? Also, is it true that their dominance hampered the creation of a strong welfare state?
3) Is that old guy from the Labour party still the president? Is he based? I remember reading about his election in 2011 with remarks about him taking a stance against zionists for their massacres - something unbeliavable here at least in the last decades.
4) Why the Labour party has always been so small and weak compared to the Anglo one or basically every other socdem/lab party everywhere in Western Europe?
5) Opinions on De Valera?
6) Is Ireland neutrality legit or something dodgy on Nato's part actually happens there? Is it true the Burgers use/used an airport there for transport of troops/weapons? Are there any hacks pushing to join Nato, stoking crap like Russiagate and the like?
7) When I visited Dublin two years ago, house prices and obviuosly rents were off the chart. I also remember a fair share of homeless gravitating around O'Connell street after dark. Is there awareness of the issue? Also, what's gonna happen when the house prices bubble will burst?
8) Do you think the parliamentary landscape will remain the same in the next years or there's some chance of some major shakeup? Is Varadkar popular?
9) Is "liberal" idpol infestating the Emerald Island - obsessive policing of speech to be "inclusive" and stuff like that - or not?
10) Do you think there will be an economic and financial crisis similar to the one at the start of the decade when the next global recession it?
Thanks and sorry if I came up with an effortpost made of questions...
Also, we have a relatively dead thread about Italy >>19862 so feel free to come shitposting there.
>>128930
The loyalist militas were the main ones who deliberately targeted random civilians for sectarian reasons. By percentage they massacred more civilians than the British forces or the Republicans.
>>128894
still confused as shit but thank you
polite sage
>>129353
1. Yes, basically. There are slight variations - FG have a reputation as being slightly more socially liberal and FF more willing to engage in public works schemes now and then, but only because FF are essentially driven by localism and clientelism.
2. The church's influence now varies from region to region. In Dublin it's mostly gone, although the rituals (funerals, weddings, communions subsist). In some rural areas it's a lot stronger, but this seems to be determined mostly by the nature of the parish priest. The influence of Catholicism has long been a convenient excuse, allowing us to ignore strong reactionary elements in our society (a lot of which, as you'd expect, were heavily promoted during colonialism)
3. Yeah he's still president, but president is a fairly meaningless position. People like him, but he doesn't weigh in very often.
4. In short - the population for most of the 20th century was generally conservative. Reasons for this (obviously my opinion): constant emigration acts as a pressure valve, because frustrated people on the cusp of consciousness leave. Weak trade unions, and as a result very low union participation rate (~24% I believe). Third, the role of socialists/trade unionists in Irish history was largely ignored, and Irish nationalism was seen (by many, not all) as consonant with staunch Catholicism, social conservatism with a mild 'conscience'. (Again, thinking of FF here).
5. Reactionary, coward. Easy to put all the blame on himself and the church, as opposed to the large class of big farmers (a tight-fisted bunch).
6. Yes, 100% true they used the airport for extraordinary rendition flights etc. We'll pretty much let them (or NATO) do whatever they like. I've never come across join-NATO sentiment, I'm sure there's some, but the general position is akin to the position during WW2 - Profess neutrality, aid power quietly.
7. It's gotten considerably worse since then. There's awareness, but it's been going on so long people don't care. By which I mean 52% of people in rural Ireland own the property they live in (i.e. are petit-porkeois) and the left is too fragmented to provide an alternative working people can support. What's going to happen? Another EU bailout, presumably. Easy liquidity from the ECB. This one is different from the last, though, because it's not accompanied by a market flooded with houses, it's artificial scarcity. So it won't burst, IMO, it might deflate slowly, because the demand for a first (as opposed to a second or third) home is basically inelastic. Hopefully we'll see some slumlords get lynched.
8. Yes to both questions, basically. Varadkar is confusingly popular because a) easy liquidity from the EU means decent quality of life for people with stable jobs and houses they own, and the left are all over the place.
9. Meh, not really, I don't think. FG are pro-gays and pro-abortion, basically Trudeau types. It's effective at taking away a certain sector of the lib vote, but those people wouldn't vote left anyway.
10. I don't think it'll be the same, no, but there will be one. The treatment will be the same; university fees go up, houses and hospitals get cut, all large-scale infrastructure plans(of which there isn't many) get 'postponed'. Porky scum get paid off.

Hope that answered it, I for one would like to see this thread in future.
>>129353
>>129181
>>129381
Dosen't change the fact that republicans after Connolly were massive dongs
>>129721
What do you mean by that? I do agree that nobody after Connolly ever matched him in his leadership, theory, and personality, but i wouldnt just write off their struggle entirely or call them "massive dongs".
Can anyone explain why so many republicans were killed by republicans? I get there was a kinda mafia-like contract that if you fucked-up you get whacked, but it always seemed really high for me.
t. bong.
>>129690
Thank you very much.
>>130005
Whats important to remember is that "republican" is actually a pretty broad group as it encompasses socialists, communists, nationalists, Catholics, and criminals. Ever since 1969 the groups split more and more and became increasingly exclusionary and bitter with each other.
Feuding between the leadership of the different paras over history or ideology led to squabbles between brigades or battalions from different IRA sects (Provo, Official). INLA was maybe the worst for this as it was almost entirely made up of rejects from other paras, and so the leadership quickly lost control and the members began to divide themselves based on personal loyalty, until it effectively just became a mob.
Borger with an immigrant mother here. Contemplating pursuing a masters degree in Ireland. How expensive would it be compared to getting it here? Would the housing crisis make it too difficult to be worth trying?

Also is there anything of note to check out regarding leftism within my mother's home city of Galway?
What do you guys think about joining the Irish army? I'd like the training but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to join an army for a capitalist state.
>>131464
If you really want to do it, do it I guess Eire is nowhere near an imperialist state
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https://twitter.com/WSMIreland/status/1196002064394051584

What do u guys think about the rising right-wing movement in Ireland & the likes of GO'D n Justin Barrett? Do you think they have any chance at all of gaining any power / influence?
Personally, im worried about their influence over the youth. I remember being attracted to the NP a couple years ago when i was a little anti-sjw west brit who thought they genuinely cared about irish nationalism and that the ebil gommunists want to impose globalist sharia mayocide on the population. I see alot of other zoomers heading down the same path & idk if theyll ever swing left like i did or just go full fash mode.
>>129983
>but i wouldnt just write off their struggle entirely or call them "massive dongs".
Well I would
After Connolly and the ICA went; it all just downward spiraled into factions promoting Sakaite views of colonialism or factions just telling people to up do terror attacks.
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>>131789
are you trying to claim that the IRA shouldn't have fought the War of Independence? Or should the Provos have just let the semi-apartheid statelet in the occupied six counties exist? I dont know where you get the idea that the IRA was ever "Sakaite". The British government explicitly oppressed Catholics and gave Protestants preferential treatment, it only makes sense they would try to end that oppressive and sectarian rule. wrt terrorism i would ask you where guerilla warfare ends and terrorism begins. Connolly studied asymmetrical warfare, too, leading up to the Rising, inspiring Collins to develop his own tactics which would then be picked up by all subsequent IRAs.

I agree that Connolly was on another level compared to any other republican leader, but he also lived in a different time, before the Soviet Union, partition, the Civil War, and the Free State. Things were a lot more complicated during the Troubles and I think you completely dismissing the IRA's, in my opinion, completely valid, struggle is taking a very simplistic view of a very complex conflict, and i dont think thats what Connolly would have done. After all, his daughter, Nora, assisted the Irregulars in the CW and allegedly supported the Provos and INLA during the Troubles.
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>>131720
>What do u guys think about the rising right-wing movement in Ireland & the likes of GO'D n Justin Barrett?
>Personally, im worried about their influence over the youth.
Kids tend to be total morons but count how many zoomers you see in this pic. Not a whole lot. You don't want to sleep on fascist groups, though, because they can sneak up on you. I'm a burger though but Ireland seems like one of the countries where a fascist party would have a lot of trouble because how does an Irish fascist party even work? Wouldn't that make reunification more difficult? So there's a conceptual problem where it feels like they're copying British far right groups and it doesn't really translate. It might be more like Canada where an attempt to form a new fascist party completely bungled the recent elections. But I think Canadians tend to be low-key reactionaries.

If you ask me, though, the main threat posed by the far right is by influencing mainstream politics, as center-right parties seek to co-opt them for the purposes of maintaining center-right political control. I think this is definitely a pattern in Australia. The Republican Party has attempted to do this in the United States, with some success, but is also encountering a lot of problems by doing this. Secondly, the far right poses a terrorism threat. This can create tension in society by setting people against each other and so forth, similar to the Al Qaeda method in Iraq and other places. There's also a risk that the security services will also weaponize far right terrorist groups for similar purposes, such as attacking the left. But I don't know whether there's a history or serious risk of that in Ireland. Might be wrong though
>>131836 (me)
>But I don't know whether there's a history or serious risk of that in Ireland.
Well, I correct myself. There is a history of that, in Northern Ireland in which the British security services weaponized far-right terrorist groups against the Catholic population.
>>131836

>co-opt them for the purposes of maintaining control

The problem for any radical movement, whether left or right, is that the very nature of being co-opted by a less radical force leads to a dilution of your own. By the time you're mainstream you've lost a lot of the charge you once had. Look at what happened to the far-right in burgerland: instead of Trump being this galvanizing force, they've been reduced to infighting, literal fucking murder that makes people even more suspicious, and a leftist pushback threatens their "gains" even more.

They talk a big game about some mythical white awakening but all I've been seeing is people fed up with their bullshit. And they know it. Depending on the youth, especially a youth that doesn't really know much outside of the thrill of saying the n-word in front of their parents, for any movement is an inherently risky move since the youth generally have not experienced the very conditions that make others radical.
>>131852
>They talk a big game about some mythical white awakening but all I've been seeing is people fed up with their bullshit. And they know it. Depending on the youth, especially a youth that doesn't really know much outside of the thrill of saying the n-word in front of their parents, for any movement is an inherently risky move since the youth generally have not experienced the very conditions that make others radical.
I agree. Not to get sidetracked talking about the far right again but I think their emphasis on recruiting youth has led them down various holes like the "New Left" of the 60s and 70s which used to have slogans (at least in the U.S.) like "Don't trust anybody over 30." But the first problem is that most people under 30 were probably not buying into their political program at the time, so you just end up with a kind of fringe youth movement that burns out and results in a lot of disillusioned people. The second problem is that the older people know a lot of shit! Maybe the New Left should have listened to communist veterans of the battles of the 1930s. But what do I know
>>131830
The ICA was around till the war of independence ended.
>The British government explicitly oppressed Catholics and gave Protestants preferential treatment
So?
They were both equally impoverished at the end of the day.
>but he also lived in a different time
>Things were a lot more complicated during the Troubles
Class struggle is the same no matter the time period
>After all, his daughter, Nora, assisted the Irregulars in the CW and allegedly supported the Provos and INLA during the Troubles.
Guess Connolly didn't pass his good genes down then.
>>131836
>Ireland seems like one of the countries where a fascist party would have a lot of trouble because how does an Irish fascist party even work? Wouldn't that make reunification more difficult?
See one of the worst parts about the current National Party strategy is that they are actively co-opting revolutionary imagery in their propaganda, whereas most other parties are too scared and liberal to do the same. They take quotes from people Connolly completely out of context and try to make it out like he was /(their)guy/. The leader of the NP has pretty much molded his persona off of Padraig Pearse. They act like Sinn Féin have given up "true" Irish nationalism to appeal to "globohomo" or "da joos", failing to recognise that the republican movement has been inherently progressive since its inception, with connections to the socialist and suffragette movements of its time.

This is important because, like you said, fascism tends to sneak up on you. My greatest fear is that eventually these symbols will become co-opted by the right (similar to pepe, ok-hand-symbol, or the swastika), and that any other party will be afraid to use them at all, for fear of losing votes by association. It would also mean any young person learning about our history would be more easily drawn into these fascist parties as they identify figures they respect, like Pearse or Michael Collins, with these reactionaries instead of the people actually carrying on their legacy. I know because it happened to me.

Heres Barrett trying to claim that James Connolly, an avid Marxist, is, "one of us". He also calls Pearse, "a man of the right".:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZDTpJbCweY
I see this narrative regurgitated almost daily on Twitter by the type of people i explained above.
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>>131874
You are aware James Connolly took part in, and gave his life for, a non-socialist uprising alongside bourgeois nationalists, right?
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What do u guys think about the Connolly Youth Movement?
https://www.cym.ie/
Are any of you guys members? I've been looking for groups to join in Dublin & they look pretty baste, but i'd be open to other suggestions if you have any.
>>126351
I'm based in Belfast. Wobblie and Workers. Any other ulstercunts here?
>>132428
They seem pretty cool but I'm not a member. I may join in the future.
Would any of ye happen to have the image file for this so I could print it off? I've dmed AIA Ireland on Twitter but they've yet to respond.
>>132428
I would like to join, but there's no organization in my county, the closest one is in Limerick. Any ideas as to what I could do?
>>132506
there might be some other orgs active closer by. Idk much about them but you could maybe look into Ógra Sinn Féin or Workers' Party Youth. ÓSF apparently has a cumainn in every county & ive heard theyre more radical than SF proper.
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>>132502
They responded. Everyone who's Irish here should print these off and put them up around your area
>>131891
>You are aware James Connolly took part in, and gave his life for, a non-socialist uprising alongside bourgeois nationalists, right?
I didn't say that there's anything wrong with that
What's was wrong with the later republicans was that they had serious autisms
>pic
Using that for whenever somebody praises Atlee lol
>>135271
Not me
>>132428
Probably your best bet I would say although i don't know that much about Irish internal politics, but they look like they have a goodish model for building a party
>>131891
You are aware that Mao also did this. You are aware that the Kurds are currently doing this. You are aware that James Connolly is probably the most based socialist to come from Ireland, Scotland, England, or Wales. Seriously name a more based one? You are aware that the stated aim of the uprising was to create a SOCIALIST REPUBLIC.

You are aware they fought directly against British capital.

They went on strikes and so on.

This is the worst take I've seen on this site in a while
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>>126351
I was born in the US but both of my parents, grandparents, etc... were born and raised in Ireland. I've visited the country several times to see my extended family. I've always wondered what the local politics of the place were. How strong is the left there? When was the last time social democrats or socialists held power? Are left wing parties completely incompetent? And how do people there feel about the insane tax incentives they've passed to bring big tech companies into the country?
>>136366
>Cork County
God that made me cringe and I'm a bong.
>>136346
Bruh i was trying to critique the other anon for dimsissing the IRA's natlib struggle while simultaneously worshipping Connolly. Not a criticism of Connolly at all.

However, i will say that the goal of the 1916 Rising was not explicitly for a socialist republic, atleast not for anyone except Connolly & the ICA. the pursuit of a socialist republic only entered mainstream republicanism after the 1st Dáil and the Civil War.
>>136366
>How strong is the left there?
Lethargic. Every election cycle we choose between two centre-right parties and bitch about how nothing's changed. Younger people are starting to reject the status quo, but theres no real viable alternative anyway.
>When was the last time social democrats or socialists held power?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limerick_Soviet
>Are left wing parties completely incompetent?
when theyre not rigging car bombs
>And how do people there feel about the insane tax incentives they've passed to bring big tech companies into the country?
they dont notice/ care because we are a nation of terminally cucked liberals who just got done being a semi-theocracy after being an imperial colony, which gave us a nation-wide inferiority complex, and as a result we still dont trust ourselves to rule ourselves.
>mfw no cultural revolution
>mfw the crown still occupies a chunk of the country
>mfw even if we win a unity referendum, England would still rule us through her capitalists, through her landlords, through her financiers, through the whole array of commercial and individualist institutions she has planted in this country and watered with the tears of our mothers and the blood of our martyrs.
>>136688
Irish Revolution has gotta be one of the more cucked in history tbh.
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Does Ireland have the potential to be a self-reliant state in the vein of DPRK?
We kind of tried this after independence under Supreme Leader De Valera & all it did was strengthen our economic ties to the Brits and cause more emigration, but i think under a socialist economy with full employment, this would be less of an issue than under Dev's protectionist nat. conservatism.
Personally, i dont think 100% self-reliance is truly possible, as things like famine or natural disasters happen & foreign aid is necessary in such situations to save lives. Rejecting international trade / co-operation also usually leads to shitty living conditions, but i would agree with Thomas Sankara PBUH when he says: "He who feeds you, controls you", & i think the more nations that embrace self reliance as a value, the less inherently exploitative the world economy would become.
Thoughts?
Just wondering how the Irish lads here feel about Britian as the "world's policeman"
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>>138918
more like the world's parasite
>>138922
Terrible meme it literally mauls the reader's eyes. Can't even make out what the fuck the bottom word is supposed to be. It's only funny when it's a nazbol meme that adds in 200 filters and grainy shit.
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>>138925
put ur reading glasses on, grandpa, itll be easier to read & u wont be as cranky
>>138911
>i think the more nations that embrace self reliance as a value, the less inherently exploitative the world economy would become. Thoughts?

Well yea self reliance for food production and other necessities is probably possible for most places.

Considering the capitalist pattern of attempting to gain control over the imputs and outputs of the workers to maximize exploitation, is somewhat replicated on the world-stage, it would likely be structurally beneficial to reduce the number of people that can be extorted this way.

But you have to realise that quite a lot of the economy is very technologically complex and replicating this on a small scale, isn't directly possible.
Although there definitely is sort of a dynamic tangentially related to miniaturisation, where small scale production can become more advanced with technology as well. But it usually isn't as efficient. That said there's definitely a possibility where you get a sort of pipeline for downscaled regional production of sectors that maxed out on development and optimization. There's also the possibility that more generalised production tools that don't need specific production-run tooling (machines that don not need to be changed for producing different things) to drive that development.

The main gain from the self sufficiency is the reduced international conflict potential.
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https://twitter.com/DarranMarshall/status/1198616484534198272?s=20
in case anyone still isnt convinced that dublin should be turned into a sea of radioactive ash
Marx duit. Is brea liom an thread seo.

>>131878
Bhuail mé leis an bhean cheile de Justin Barrett, agus duirt sí liom gur tá sé ag fulaingt le halcólacht. He's been losing his mind.
>>139564
tá brón orm, níl mo gaeilge ró-maith, ach sure ill give it a go.

>tá sé ag fulaingt le halcólacht
bhuel, is ciall leis sin, ach, ní leiscéil é do na rudaí a dhéanainn sé agus a deireann sé. béidir nach bhfuil sé an fhadhb mhór, ach mar a duirt anon burgar >>131836 : "you don't want to sleep on fascist groups, though, because they can sneak up on you". gan JB, tá na eite dheis ag fás in Éirinn, agus tá níos mó imní orm faoin éifeacht ar polaitíocht mainstream agus ar na daoine óga.

apologies if that makes no sense, i need to brush up on my cúpla focail
>>126852
with brexit do you think theres a chance of a northern ireland reunification referendum passing?
>>139642
if you ask the west-brits in the republic: Just Fucking Barely! >>139338

and i doubt the Unionists up north would allow that sort of thing. historically speaking, rigging elections is the only thing theyre good at, apart from being a shower of cunts.

while it is theoretically possible if sinn fein get their act together, i personally wouldnt get my hopes up
]>>139640
GRMA. Faoi do gaeilge, níl aon fhadhb anseo cara.
Bí pairteach nó tosaigh an Pop-up Gaeltacht i do cheantar. Tá sé ócáid iontach chun bualadh le daoine/comradai eile agus oibriú leo.
Thosaigh mé an grupa i mo baile, agus is aoibheann liom é.

Maidir leis an by-election, bhí an NP ag tabhairt tacaíochta do Gemma OD le deanaí, ach fuair sí ach amhain 1000 votai. Beag agus mall. Ach, creidim thu. Chonaic me an cruinniu seo caite den NP, agus raibh cupla daoine ansin. A lán seandaoine ait, agus cupla amadáin ginearálta cé ag gáfa leis na youtube echo-chamber. Nior aon mná fós, lol.

https://youtu.be/EyAW0gwxQ8k
UP THE IRA
>>145897
>ineffectual attempts at isolationist autarky are responsible for all its greatest woes
They are under trade embargo.
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what do you guys think about the Official IRA / Worker's Party? Are they based juche sleeper agents? or ultra-lefty pseudo-unionists? I've heard they had some connections to loyalist groups during the troubles, which sounds pretty cringe imo.
Also has anybody read 'The Lost Revolution' by Brian Hanley and Scott Millar? is it any good?
>>154268
most based out of all
>>145897
ahah lol fuck yourself kruschevite scum
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Any of my colonised brothers in the north out there? Hows the voting going lads?
>>154268
>Also has anybody read 'The Lost Revolution' by Brian Hanley and Scott Millar? is it any good?

Yes, you should read it.
>>154268
They were the type to tell you to read settlers and replace all mentions of blacks with the word catholic.
>>161384
The EU is a neoliberal capitalist institution which is opposed by communist parties in Europe
>>156573
I'm not from Uslter but I'm pretty sure Sinnn Féin just secured a historic victory in the GE.
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>>161681
What party is the lightish yellow.
>>161695
Libdems' Irish branch
>>161379
No they weren't, now fuck off
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https://revolutionaryleftradio.libsyn.com/irish-republican-army-ira-anti-imperialism-guerrilla-warfare-and-socialism Revleft did an episode on the IRA with the guy from Radical Reflections. Surprised this wasn't posted here sooner.
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The Free State gov is planning a commemoration for the Royal Irish Constabulary and Black and Tans on 17th of January at Dublin Castle. Dublin City Council have voted to boycott the event, among others. There's also rumours of plans by Louth CC to commemorate Cromwellian soldiers in Drogheda later this year. Are they licking boot to try to appeal to unionists in the face of a possible reunification referendum? or maybe to appease the Brits in the face of Brexit? Are we ever going to get over this inferiority complex lads? Are we destined to permanently cuck ourselves out to the Brits? Feels like all the bloodshed was for nothing if all we have to show for it is a partitioned tax-haven that cant even take a stand against attempted genocide and imperial domination. Pic related are two brothers killed by the B&Ts. They were torched and had grenades stuffed in their mouths. This is what the Blueshirts are commemorating. Sign these petitions if you think it'll help: https://www.change.org/p/fine-gael-don-t-commemorate-the-black-and-tans?utm_content=cl_sharecopy_19939502_en-GB%3Av5&recruiter=881462486&recruited_by_id=a54202e0-6e3c-11e8-a1ea-b3d2584d29da&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_campaign=psf_combo_share_abi&share_bandit_exp=abi-19939502-en-GB&share_bandit_var=v1 https://www.change.org/p/fine-gael-stop-louth-county-council-plan-to-commemorate-cromwellian-soldiers-killed-in-drogheda?recruiter=false&recruited_by_id=e4543530-2fc8-11ea-b798-991d57076127&share_bandit_exp=initial-19958774-en-GB&share_bandit_var=v2&use_react=false
How did Ireland became such a bourgeois shithole? From what I understand early IRA people were quite socialist.
Go on home british soldiers go on home have you got no fucking home of your own
>>201703 Because there was a civil war and the right wing nutjobs won. And have been more or less running the county ever since. Liberalism of the last 20 years is an advancement.
>>201703 because porky always wins
>>201914 Nice one lads
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>>202081 well boys, we did it. Imperialism is no more.
>>201703 They made sure to shoot Connolly. Then DeValera made sure to integrate the Irish labour force into a predominantly English based economy. >“If you remove the English Army tomorrow and hoist the green flag over Dublin Castle., unless you set about the organization of the Socialist Republic your efforts will be in vain. England will still rule you. She would rule you through her capitalists, through her landlords, through her financiers, through the whole array of commercial and individualist institutions she has planted in this country and watered with the tears of our mothers and the blood of our martyrs.” ― James Connolly
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Taoiseach has confirmed the GE will be taking place Saturday 8th of February. Word of notice to any electoralfags who registered to vote in the last year: The register does not come into effect until the 15th of Feb. Therefore you will not be registered to vote by the time the GE comes. You will have to apply to the Supplementary Register if you want to vote on the 8th. The deadline to register on the SR is 14 days before the polling date, or, the 24th of January. More info on registration here: https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1216802428856782848 and here: https://www.vote.ie/register This is obviously a pretty transparent attempt by FG to suppress younger voters. Whatever, not like voting is ever gonna change the status quo in this country.
>>212907 quick note: by "in the last year", i meant from 15th February 2019. If you got in before the register came into effect, youre grand, but if you want to be sure, you can check the register here: http://www.checktheregister.ie/
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Me and the boys.
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>>126351 My name is Ruairí but I am unfortunately a burger.
Explain how the IRA were socialist. What did they do that shows this?
>>239160 They weren't, but they opposed British imperialism. The only big Socialist movement in Ireland was with James Connolly in early 1900's.
>>239160 Their politics? You do realise most IRA groups were connected to political parties, right? Also there is no general "IRA". Not since the 1920's. It all started with the Irish Citizen's Army, an openly Marxist army led my Connolly, who was indeed a Marxist.
>>239173 >Their politics? Imagine being this vague lmao. How about actually specifically mentioning their politics.
>>239185 Sein Fein
>>239192 They're not socialist though?
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>>239160 Well first of all there have been multiple distinct groups who have taken on the name "IRA" over the years. The first IRA or "Old IRA" fought in the War of Independence. It was a broad front organisation made up of catholics, nationalists, and a small amount of more radical elements. The closest thing the Old IRA had to an economic policy was the Democratic Programme of the First Dáil, which called for: 'the public ownership of the means of production, natural resources and "wealth"; state provision of education for children and care for the elderly; ensuring that children receive food; promotion of industrial development as well as the exploitation of natural resources.' The Anglo-Irish Treaty which ended the WoI would then cause a split between the right-wing British-backed "pro-Treaty" Free State Army and the more radical "anti-Treaty IRA", who upheld the Democratic Programme and opposed partition. After losing the subsequent civil war the latter group would drift leftwards as marxist leadership took over in the 60s. The new leadership rejected traditional republican militarism, and adopted a class-based outlook. This however led to them rejecting any actions that could be seen as "sectarian", including defending the Catholic communities of the occupied 6 counties from violence by Protestant mobs or the state police. After the embarrassment the IRA faced for failing to protect protestors from state violence during the Battle of the Bogside, they split again into the Marxist "Official IRA", and the more traditional republican "Provisional IRA". The Provos were another broad-front and early on lacked a cohesive economic policy as they were focused more on the military campaign against Britain, however they did claim to be fighting for a democratic socialist republic. They very shortly had a policy called "Éire Nua", which was sort of based on local community self-management? but they soon did away with it and experienced another left-shift in the 1980s as they began to engage with literature by thinkers like Fanon, Gramsci and Che Guevara while in prison. They aligned themselves solidly with the international left, as seen in this quote from their 1986 Ard Fheis: " That this Ard-Fheis supports the following socialist countries and the aid many of them give to Third World countries engaged in struggle: a. The Republic of Cuba, and the aid it gives to the people of Angola and Nicaragua; b. The Peoples Democratic Republic of Korea, and its aim of uniting all of Korea under socialism; c. The Democratic Republic of Vietnam, which has united its country after years of struggle and foreign interference; … h. That the Ard-Fheis recognises the governments of the Soviet Union, Poland, GDR, Czechoslovakia, Rumania and Bulgaria as being progressive countries, with good socialist policies int he way of housing, health care, job creation, etc. Recognises the suffering these countries endured during the last world war at the hand of fascists and collaborators. Sinn Féin recognises that it was the Soviet army and its people which broke the back of the Nazis. Sinn Fein is totally opposed to the anti-Soviet policies of the Washington, London and Bonn governments. " Unfortunately, after the fall of the SU and the subsequent Good Friday agreement ending the armed struggle, SF have been on a steady course of liberalisation over the years as they increase focus on purely parliamentary endeavors in Stormount and in the Dáil Éireann. With the Provisionals gone, numerous dissident groups have emerged who rejected the peace process. The "Continuity IRA" split when the Provos started to shift left in the 80s. They uphold the whole Éire Nua stuff and claim to be the one true republican organisation. the INLA split from the Officials during the 70s as they wanted to continue the armed struggle. They quickly devolved into a clusterfuck of warring sects and divisions after the Officials killed their founder and nobodies sure if theyre even still around. The most notable group is probably the "Real IRA" or "New IRA" who split over the peace process itself. Like the early Provos, they pay lip service to socialism but have no clear economic vision for the country and focus mostly on policing their communities and kneecapping drug dealers. So in conclusion: The IRA has always been aligned with the left due to their position in a national liberation struggle. While the specifics of their socialist policies are sometimes unclear, it is a consistent feature of all iterations of the group from the 1920s to the modern day. Irish Republicanism as an ideology has gone hand-in-hand with socialism since Connolly, and i would highly recommend his writings to anyone questioning the fundamental relationship between the political and economic struggles. As he himself said: "The cause of Labour is the cause of Ireland. The cause of Ireland is the cause of Labour."
So how come religious right wasable to defeat the socialist left in 1922
>>127026 >semtex For how long can it be stored before it deteriorates?
Will Brexit make reunification possible?
>>240978 The Free State Army was backed by the British government, who gave them training, vehicles, and artillery. Meanwhile the IRA was in bad shape. One of the reasons they entered Treaty negotiations in the first place was because they did not think the armed campaign would be able to last much longer. They also lost many members due to the split.
>>241055 It's got people talking about it at least. And nationalist candidates recently won a historic victory in the NI General Election. Personally i think it depends on how much of a disaster Brexit turns out to be.
Was discussing this in leftybritpol. If the whole of the United Kingdom somehow managed to establish communism through some kind of armed revolt or coup, and turned London into a "national free" area where it better assembled and presented the communist constituencies of England, Wales an Scotland etc. Would Irish communists be inclined to support one big Union of the British Isles?
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>>241315 Personally? no, and i think most of the Irish left should agree. Ireland always has been and still is a very different place to Britain both culturally and materially. Not to mention that most British people, even the left, have absolutely abysmal education wrt British imperialism in Ireland and i think this would cause a huge clash if there ever was a union. Even the term "British Isles" is seen as inflammatory by alot of Irish people. That leftybrit thread is full of these kind of people who are spooked hard with the whole "dont break the union!!!" shite as if they were fucking tories, even bordering on genuine irredentism. Of course in the case of a 32 county socialist republic and a "Union of British Socialist Republics" or whatev, i wouldnt be against cooperation in trade and defence etc simply because of our geographical circumstances. Think more Warsaw Pact than USSR.
>>241513 As a britbong, I can see that most people swallowed the propaganda shat out by the English ruling class and can only see the IRA as being one big, confusing group in a detached 'they did some things that happened' way. Not excusing all of what happened in the troubles and such, but I can totally sympathise with the fight for Independence and, even better, potentially establishing a socialist nation right on Britain's doorstep.
>>241748 Oh Socialist Brits would more the definitely fight for an Irish commie state. Some londoners fought for the Irish Citizens Army, although technically they were half irish.
>>241513 >That leftybrit thread is full of these kind of people who are spooked hard with the whole "dont break the union!!!" shite as if they were fucking tories, even bordering on genuine irredentism. Ireland should obviously be united. But splitting up Britain (Northern Ireland is not part of Britain) will solve nothing.
>>241795 Eh. I agree but I can see it working both ways. You could make it like a socialist confederacy of state with a common military perhaps (to defend the revolution etc.)
who /kneecap/ here
You lot seen the pannelbase poll? FF: 23% SF: 21% FG: 19% Green: 10% SocDem: 5% PBP: 5% Labour: 5%
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>>243052 hilarious to see all the salty brits on twitter who still think the provos exist reacting to this. idk how accurate it is but if SF could kick FG & FF out of gov that'd be pretty based.
>>243065 What’s the electoral process again? Will SF be the second largest party via % alone?
>>243065 Yeah the irony is that southern SF are just nationalist socdems. And someone pointed out that if you add up the votes for SF, Green, SocDem, PBP, and Lab that's 47% for the "left". That doesn't even include votes for lefty independents. >>243078 STV, so vote %s aren't great indicators of seats. SF would likely be the second largest party based on this though.
>>243080 >Yeah the irony is that southern SF are just nationalist socdems. and these bongs still swear theyre scary radical antifa marxists who want to carbomb the queen. i wish >if you add up the votes for SF, Green, SocDem, PBP, and Lab that's 47% for the left yeah, its a shame theyd never form a coalition but it shows that people want change at least.
>>243099 >southern SF are just nationalist socdems. Is it a way 'lets slowly reform captialism to socialism' kinda way at least? >its a shame theyd never form a coalition Why? Too little seats overall?
>>244400 >Is it a way 'lets slowly reform captialism to socialism' kinda way at least? Yeah but also like in comparison to Northern Sinn Féin: which has MLAs that literally blew shit up and shot people. >Why? Too little seats overall? Last two polls say that no actually, but if push comes to shove Irish Labour has a history of choosing FG or FF over a left wing coalition. Also we don't know if the Greens will cuck out or not.
>>127578 >>127520 Good PBP crew in Tralee when I was living there
>>131836 >Jimmy Boi Larkin on the placards I'm a bong and this brings me to incandescent rage.
>>156573 Why don't they have Foyle?
>>161900 Not quite. Alliance formed in a very similar way to the lib dems but they are their own thing. Basically they evolved as a political wing of the protestant element of the NICRA.
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>>244738 do you mean Michael Collins? Or the other guy who i cant quite make out. wouldnt put it past them though, sure they try to claim James Connolly aswell.
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Hey fellas Proles of the Round Table did an episode a short while ago with the Connolly Youth Movement talking about Irish history and the CYM. Thought i should post it here even though its been a couple weeks. https://prolespod.libsyn.com/ep-45-ireland-and-the-cym
https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1223381353724551169 Some weirdos (likely from NP) protesting against FG for "demographic rights". Funniest part is that the bloke at the end goes to say Finna [Fail] didn't even know who they were protesting against.
>>245111 >Proles of the Round Table cringe
>>246251 i want to fuck you i want to put my fist down your throat and my other fist up your ass until they meet in the middle and i rip you in two
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>>247677 the virgin "nationalist" Wooomer vs the chad IRA Boomber
>>247713 Is she a Provo?
>>247713 Oh that's the best part, the ginger in the red dress is a Fine Gael official who didn't wanted it to be filmed...
>>247723 >Fine Gael literal fascists.
>>247723 lmao wut i thought she was trying to stop the guys faces being caught. thats just fucking bizarre then why wouldnt she want it filmed?
>>247698 Proles is good
>>241315 Absolutely not.
>>241315 Wouldn't mind a confederation with common stuff like a common military to protect the revolution but no Ireland should be independent.
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Found this lefty voting guide on twitter. Looks about right.
>>262274 Limmy supports people before profit lmao
>>262281 Further cementing his based status.
>>262274 Does the I4C really vary that much and how different are they from PBP?
>>262359 PBP are more class focused whereas I4C are more ideological: the latter cares more about a radical welfare state whereas PBP believe in shit like direct organising.
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Can anybody educate me on the irish unification effort? I support it, but i have heard arguments that "muh irish catholics would genocide irish protestants if they united" before. Is support high for unification?
>>262618 Ireland should annex that anglo outpost.
>>262618 The main fucking barrier to irish unification is autistic religious bickering. This shit has been the main part of the whole Ulster/Ireland fight since the days of Cromwell.
>>262618 >"""irish""" protestants you mean anglo colonisers?
>>262638 I could call Irish Catholics Roman colonisers. Still makes no fucking difference.
>>262638 protestant =/= unionist. Wolf Tone, father of Irish Republicanism was a protestant. many native irish people converted to protestantism during the famine to avoid starvation or to get jobs that were barred for catholics. Republicanism is anti-sectarian
Media here never talks about Ireland, but know that SF MIGHT win the elections they're going crazy. Keep it up!
>>265244 Why would we want them to? They're not left-wing
>>262618 >Can anybody educate me on the irish unification effort? There isn't one. There's no plan in place for Irish unification so any possible benefits are as valid as any of the potential negatives.
>>265257 Give me a quick rundown on Sinn Fein then.
>>265257 because we've been stuck with the same 2 centre-right parties for almost a hundred years and SF is the only viable alternative? They do also have some fairly left-wing policies if you read their manifesto. >>265314 They used to be socialists but have been shifting centrewards in recent years and pandering to middle-class voters. They were anti-EU but went soft-eurosceptic after the Brexit referendum but their manifesto still says they will oppose an EU army or federalisation. They've also expressed support for Cuba, Venezuela, and Bolivia's right to self-determination. Basically they're anti-imperialist socdems with Irish nationalist characteristics.
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I hope, on the big day, all my fellow electoralist shills are voting CathBol as well
I hear you have Nazbols called Anotú.
>>265353 >irish monarchist collectivism theres not fucking way this autism is real
>>265353 He's right. If a loyalist want his king, the republic should give him one.
>>265353 This is one of the more insane things I've ever read.
>>265353 Based >>265360 nah theyre not that autistic, just anti-abortion Sinn Féin
>>265353 The natural conclusion of thinking that Catholics are oppressed.
>>265353 Wait so does he want to ban divorce again or make it so you can’t remarry?
>>265353 what the fuck bro
>>265388 He wants to ban divorce again.
>>265388 He wants only those to marry who actually mean it so in practice most would not.
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>>265353 Show me one (1) thing wrong with this.
>>265401 Leftist social policies aren't individualist.
>>265403 Social collectivism means taking Ireland back to the 1980s?
>>265353 Ffs, this is what happens when nazbol is taken too far. >>265403 The Left has always been made and build an individualist position stupidpol
>>265481 It's in my interest to not care about others and just advance myself though, including investing and so on.
>>265515 >it is my interest to play a game where property exist and is in enforced by the imaginary being called the State. It is precisely only through socialism that 99% of people can 'advance' themselves, whether they care about others or not. Why do people magically think that self interested suddenly equates to temporary embarrassed millionaire?
>>265629 Forgot pic.
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>>162008 lick my nuts to further take in the salt, catholic "civil rights" identitarian.
>>265972 Is this good? PBP is kinda low...
Which ones are the protestants and which the catholics?
>>266238 they appear to be up a % since the last GE though
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>>265972 >>266238 Both finn gael and sinn fein support reunification (according to wikipedia), despite finn gael being a liberal party. The major party that doesn't support reunification is fianna fail (because it doesn't say they support it in their ideology section on wikipedia). That means that at least 44% of votes support reunification, not counting the smaller parties. Basically the general consensus is for reunification and irish patriotism.
>>265353 What the fuck
>>266495 >Basing your answer on Wikipedia Cringe
>>132428 Not a member, but in contact with a few CYMers. They seem like a class group of people and they've grown a lot lately. Seriously considering joining, the only problem is that the CPI, who they are connected to, is comprised from what I can tell boomers and is dwarfed in numbers by the CYM, I believe. >>132506 I have the same problem. Idk what to do.
Will an SF-led government launch the referendum on letting Irish citizens living abroad vote in elections?
>>266495 >Fine Gael supports unification <Fianna Fail doesn't Bruh that's literally the wrong way around. FG is the descendant of the pro-treaty SF and FF is the descendant of the anti-treaty SF. FF hypes itself up as the "republican party" but in reality it doesn't give a shit and only makes vague noises towards this. You've gotta realise the bulk of irish politics 1925-1990s was not class or culture or geographically based, but based on clientelism. It's why FF/FG are so similar, they are from different ideological roots due to teh civil war but for about 50 years they were nothing more than glorified clientelistic networks.
>>266852 Think they've got a few constitutional things planned I think, Senate abolition, making nationalised water constitutional etc.
Where are the results?
Why did Ireland favor STV as opposed to MMP?
>>267004 Thanks you
>>267007 STV was invented in Ireland, and they didn't want FPTP following independence at the risk that the country would be a one-party-state (as it had been de facto as a part of Britain).
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<With 96% of #GE2020 botes tallied nationwide… <SF 24.1% >FF 22.2% >FG 22.1% >Greens 7.4% >Labour 4.1% >SD 3.0% >SolPBP 2.8% >Other parties 3.3% >Inds 12.1% The zoomers will save us all
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>>267266 Now we wait for the Ulster zoomers
>>267266 "the most conservative generation"
Did you fuckers actually do it or is this result getting iowad?
>>267285 Nope. Its real. Here's the results if you want to keep an eye on it. https://www.rte.ie/news/election-2020/results/#/national
>>267282 The liberals simply want to label the gen z as fascistic when they are simply anti-liberal.
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>>267266 One third of the Imperialist Isles down, next the land of the Scots!
>>267332 At least Sinn Fein is demsoc. SNP is limp dick center left milky socdem. Might as well support the CPB for now. Make clydeside red again.
>>267336 SNP are not socdem they are liberals.
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>>265360 This is Catholicphobia
>>267287 lmao Exit polls lied to me.
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How many brothers fell victim to the streetz Rest in peace, young nigga, theres a heaven for a G Be a lie if I told ya that I never thought of death My nigga, we're the last ones left
SF have so far lost 3 possible seats, that puts them at 39.
>>267629 I'm not sure why, but this made me cry laughing.
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So Sinn Fein won? This is good news right?
>>267673 Don't hold your breath anon, They're still counting the votes. Best to sleep and check in the morning.
>>244727 im not a trot though
>>267266 59.5% for the 5 left wing parties
Why are Sinn Féin pro-EU? I'd expect left-wing nationalists to be staunchly against it, are they just liberals?
>>268663 Sinn Fein is eurosceptic and has campaigned for 'No' during the referendums.
Will PBP lose seats this election? Kinda feel bad for them even though they are trots.
>>268829 But they endorsed "remain" for Brexit, why?
>>268841 Because they oppose a hard border on the island.
>>268852 That's pretty cucked, how about kicking out the anglo instead?
>>268897 No one wants a repeat of the Troubles.
>>268897 I guess they are favoring strategic over the tactical.
>>268833 same. im happy gino eventually got in
>>268897 Can you be any more American?
Britbong, here. Memes aside, is Gerry Adams based or not? I don't know much about The Troubles in truth, but from the pieces i've heard he didn't sound great.
Long live the Irish struggle for unity, a Welshman/Briton. >>267332 No, Scotland is part of Britain and dividing Britain is not progressive. Ireland is an oppressed nation, Scotland is not oppressed and along with Wales and England equally comprises Britain. >>267435 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rQLmzBXDbI
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So here's the results of the election, if anyone is curious.
Imagine calling people who are critical of Sinn Fein a 'bootlicker'. The absolute state of the Irish left-wing
>>268833 They're clearly the most left wing party not associated with paramilitaries. Even if you don't like trots why wouldn't you support PFP?
>>270524 to be fair most of the criticism they get today is from blueshirts. although óghra sinn féin has quite a bit of those types who think sinn féin are going to establish real socialism.
>>270488 So, did SF win or...?
>>270858 they got the highest percentage of first preferences but to get into government you need 80 seats. No party has this so whoever can create a coalition with 80 seats first will get in.
>>270877 Would SF have enough seats if they brought in the other left parties and maybe some independent politicians? FF and FG still have a shitload of seats.
>>271000 Not quite: too many cuck Independents.
>>271058 So Ireland goes without a government, how long does that last before there's a new election?
>>271091 theoretically speaking: as long as it needs to. until then Varadkar is still in power.
>>154268 Workers Party are based and recognized that the catholic and protestant proletariat had more in common and attempted to build class unity.
>>128894 Kudos for an objective and accurate summary Seamus t. Leftist Unionist There will be a united Ireland - within a British polity - in a newly constituted Federal Socialist Republic of GB and Ireland No surrender
>>130352 I Nick & Loot Anything Kek
>>139660 >from being a shower of cunts I take exception to that Seamus We prefer the term "barrel" of cunts If you faggots had a clue youd work for progress on both sides of the border and shut up about reunification. The border will fade away organically if repukes and loychavs quit eternally spouting off and triggering each other
>>262649 >Republicanism is anti-sectarian Your actions say otherwise, lip service notwithstanding Face it - Ulster has been marred by sectarianism since the Defenders and Peep'o'Day boys The updated facade of faux-marxism on some brands of militant republicans changes nothing Wolf Tone would hate the contemporary republican movement
Tbh a harsh reality is that if irish unification happens: it will be because the protestant PMC vote for it.
>>265314 SF don't know what they are.Since giving up their failed "military" campaign theyve flip flopped on everything. They only have one center of gravity - hatred of the British and seething resentment towards ulster scots - all else is window dressing. Theyre now fully on board with the neo-liberal capitalist globalisation agenda and virtue signal adnauseam like the good little idpol fuckwits they are. Theyre incompetent reactionaries at heart desperately searching for the facade of a coherent ideology and praxis. The only thing they were good at was blowing shit up and entrenching sectarian division in the North for another 3 generations minimum
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>>277403 Posting some lumpenprole rapper - appropriate I'm not Anglo. By blood I am highland and lowland scot. Family moved to a NON-PLANTATION Ulster county centuries ago. Some of my ancestors were Presbyterian United Irishmen. I have some Norman Irish in me which is the closest thing to "anglo". I'd wager I'm more Gael than you faggot - probably have significantly less anglo blood running through my veins than your own. Not that I have any tribal bourgeois hatred of anglos - it's ancient history - something you bitches seen incapable of getting over.
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>>278033 Its funny witnessing someone who is both lumpenprole,reactionary and bourgeois idpol all at the same time. But logical consistency never was the republican movement's strong point now was it. Your current policy of brits out,blacks in seems sure to make your picture an upfront reality in a quaint little irish village real soon. Enjoy Give my regards to your lgbt and abortion department.
Taking your Anglo-centric nazbol shit elsewhere fam
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>>278126 Well if 50cent moved to Ireland he'd be just as Irish as you right? New Irish. Just as long as he aint one of those dirty huns right? Don't be racist now Seamus. He's as Irish as you now and so is Abdul here - theyre not rape gangs Seamus - theyre culturally diverse grooming reachout gropus. Dont be a bigot now. Islam is just as Irish as catholicism - which is woke now. Don't be mixing with those dirty prods though. They need booted out. Top kek Seamus
>>278126 >youre British Technically so are you btw British derives from Prettani - the celtic tribes who populated both these islands- hence the British Isles The romans first coined the term Great Britain to refer to the bigger of the 2 while they referred to Eire as little Britain. No shit - look it up Anglosaxons ,vikings and then Normans showed up a few centuries later and mixed it up a bit. Fun times My direct ancestors were probably floating around Dalriada at the time on the north coast of Ireland and the west coast of Scotland. If we leave Ulster are you gonna take all the Irish back from Glasgow,Liverpool and London?
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>>278172 Such seething hatred of your little old ulsterscot prod neigbour who's been living with you for 400 years. Can't even bring yourself to have a nice wee cosy chat - or even a wee bit of cheeky banter You're no craic you lad. >workers of the world unite Full of shit arent ya? Youre not a leftist m8 - youre an ethnonationalist masquerading as a marxist/liberal lefty luvvie and the cognitive dissonance has fucked your brain. Id rather have the National Party than you schizoids. Atleast theyre fucking consistent
>>278172 Theyre also more honest Will I still be British if there's a United Ireland and I opt to remain living here? Or can I be both Irish and British at the same time? Or will I just be Irish then? Like Bono or Edmund Burke - kek Decisions decisions
>>278172 Ah youre no craic at all Worse than the calvinists you lot
Fuck me sideways.
>>285629 How would that translate to seats?
>>278150 Mate, Islamic Leaders at least helped Eire in it's time of need.
>>285680 Hard to say, but would be a fucking barnstormer for the Sinners.
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Article about Lenin's supposed 'Rathmines accent' in his English speech according to the son of James Connolly: https://www.rferl.org/a/lenin_irish_accent/24475717.html
>>290012 Not that guy but are you against ulster protestant marxists who support the union? To the point of refusing to speak to them?
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>>292598 im genuinely confused as to how a principled marxist could support the union in any way. even marx knew ireland should be independant. partition has economically crippled both states on this island and caused us to be plunged into almost 100 years of reactionary conservatism and religious semi-apartheid. they must be wholly ignorant of the history of ireland or brainwashed by the endless "dont break muh union god save the queen" bs coming from the british establishment. theyre cucks to the corpse of an empire that probably doesnt even give half as much of a shit about them as they do about it.
>>292598 How can you have Marxist principles while supporting continued colonialist imperialism?
>>292710 >>292714 Cockshott is a unionist tho.
>>292710 Some would content that building non-sectarian class consciousness between protestant and catholic working classes is better praxis than fixation on petit booj nationalist concerns. One dude I know says working for socialism within a larger richer union of nations is better praxis. My question was not about that though. > are you against ulster protestant marxists who support the union? To the point of refusing to speak to them? Seems reactionary,sectarian
>>292751 >Some would contend*
>>292717 yeah and while it doesnt effect his work on economics its definitely a cringe ass position to hold. some highlights from the wiki page of the first party he joined, the British and Irish Communist Organisation: >The B&ICO argued that it was the Southern government's refusal to accept the Ulster Protestants' right of self-determination that was the cause of the "Troubles" >In the February 1974 general election, Clifford proposed advocating a vote for the Conservative Party over the Labour Party. >The ICO/B&ICO was strongly anti-Trotskyist, and it also opposed the Marxism of Rosa Luxemburg and Che Guevara. >The B&ICO opposed Welsh Nationalism and Scottish Independence. It also strongly supported the state of Israel. >B&ICO supported the Khmer Rouge regime and opposed the Vietnamese invasion of Cambodia.
>>292714 Do you define all the protestants in NI as colonisers then? Should they be removed/ethnically cleansed?
>caused us to be plunged into ... years of reactionary conservatism and religious semi-apartheid Yeh pretty sure that's all the PIRA campaign achieved too. OIRA were marxists. You lot weren't/aren't. Quit the pose.
What’s it like to be Irish?
>>292803 Embarrassing at the moment. We have PIRA apologists pretending to be marxists like the fuckwit in here. Meanwhile SF and the rest of the country have adopted pro EU neolib idpol bullshit to the max.
>>292751 >One dude I know says working for socialism within a larger richer union of nations is better praxis. >that's right, prole. if you help us oppress and exploit more people, that just means more workers to help your little revolution! it definitely doesnt make us stronger or anything. its internationalism! this is how you get the Trot to Neocon pipeline, kids. >are you against ulster protestant marxists who support the union? yes >To the point of refusing to speak to them? ill call them a retard but if they refuse to listen that's their problem >>292765 >Do you define all the protestants in NI as colonisers then? no. plenty were gaelic irish who took the soup. >Should they be removed/ethnically cleansed? no, and nobody says they should be retard. >>292798 OIRA sat on their asses while Catholics were being pogrommed by protestant mobs and massacred by police. The provos did bad shit but they werent nearly as bad as loyalist gangs or state police, whose violence the OIRA were complicit in.
>>292814 PIRA? Modern iteration of IRA?
>>292831 >this is how you get the Trot to Neocon pipeline As opposed to a PIRA to EU neolib idpol pipeline. Great >ill call them a retard but if they refuse to listen that's their problem Is that what you were doing with fiddycent? >no, and nobody says they should be Glad to hear it. Though Gerry pretty much overtly stated this in the early 80s >OIRA sat on their asses "I Ran Away" Granted but that wasnt the point. If PIRA had simply been an effective defense force I wouldnt blame them. Instead they launched a hopeless insurgency that entrenched prole division and achieved absolutely nothing
>>292862 Provisional IRA They broke off from the Official IRA (marxists) around the early 70s OIRA called a permanent cease fire 1972. PIRA continued for another 3 decades - ultimately failing in their goal for a united ireland. Sinn Fein (PIRA political party) are now progressive idpol pro EU shitlibs fixated on abortion,fag marriage,trans rights and triggering proddies It's all so fucking tiresome
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>The provos did bad shit but they werent nearly as bad as loyalist gangs or state police >The other side were worse guys >Even though we murdered 2000 people ie more than everyone else combined Pathetic. Own your shit.
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>>292899 And we're back to fiddy posting when you don't have an argument/answer. I rest my case faggot. You're an ethnonat who can't admit it.
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>>292961 If you live in NI so are you bitch. Enjoy.
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Just so you know, you both are behaving kinda nazbol with your national bullshittery.
>>292984 Idk man I side with the fiddyposter more tbh. SF is not really nazbol tbh.
>>292882 >idpol pro EU shitlibs fixated on abortion,fag marriage,trans rights and triggering proddies <USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST WTF? I love the EU now? This board is a joke.
>>292991 >SF is not really nazbol But the 'SF' poster has been reposting the same picture over and over
>>131874 >Class struggle is the same no matter the time period you fucking imbecile. within 1 chapter of capital marx explains how class struggle looks different under the different manufacturing and industrial modes of capitalism alone
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>>292991 picrel >>292984 >>292997 i just wanted angloposter to go away tbh, hes been shitting up the thread and fiddy triggers him for some reason
Everything but the Citizen Army was for local Catholic kulaks. Goodbye and fuck unionists.
>>292997 To make the anglo seethe with his nazbol shit (he was banned earlier ITT). Isn't it obvious?
How was the anglo/ni prod marxist seething? All I see is endless flooding of fiddy "you're british" ad nauseam
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creating a reactionary corporatist nightmare to own the anglos is powerful ngl.
>>293025 As far as I can tell, anglo was saying that PIRA were nazbol and that OIRA were the genuine marxists. To which SF poster just flooded "don't care,youre british" which kinda proves anglo's point. Kek This place is weird - all over the place ideologically esp the rules

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